Author Topic: E30 M3 CABs (Read 6547 times)

mikesjo · « **on:** February 04, 2007, 03:15:54 AM »

What are the pros/cons. Will the increased negative camber increase tire wear significantly? Will camber corrective front shock mounts offset the negative camber from the m3 CABs? I have these sitting at home and wondering if I should put them on or get a pair that are centered but solid (don't know what brand though, havn't looked into this).

The car is on H&R Race and Bilstein sports already.

Opinions welcomed!

e9nine · « **Reply #1 on:** February 04, 2007, 09:06:20 AM »

They are for increased caster mainly due to their "offset" character. Slap em on and get an alignment and enjoy. Caster isn't harsh on tire wear. Camber isn't as harsh on tire wear, it's usually "toe" that eats your tires up. I always run zero toe as a nice compromise.

sheepdog · « **Reply #2 on:** February 04, 2007, 01:19:21 PM »

Camber will eat up the inside edge of your tire if you run too much on the street. This can be corrected by having the tires unmounted, rotated and remounted once in a while.

By the way e9ine, zero toe is terrible on your car. When you accelerate, your tires are actually toeing out, making it more difficult to corner. You are killing your mileage, handling, and making things harder on yourself.

On a front wheel drive car, you want zero toe because as you accelerate, the wheels pull themselves together for some toe-in. FWD increases toe on acceleration, rwd reduces toe. Add a little, it will make the car come alive, and will not hurt your mileage, in fact it will help it.

mikesjo · « **Reply #3 on:** February 04, 2007, 01:46:25 PM »

How do you fix toe since it increases tire wear?

2002maniac · « **Reply #4 on:** February 04, 2007, 02:35:13 PM »

Sheepdog,
E30's actually gain negative toe under rear suspension squat.

Zero toe is just fine but the car will feel a little "loose". A little negative toe is good to keep the car tracking straight.

To adjust the toe, just go to an alignment shop. They will adjust the tierods.

M3 CAB's are good. They improved the feel of my car at all speeds. It is hard to have too much caster.

mikesjo · « **Reply #5 on:** February 04, 2007, 04:16:29 PM »

Thanks for the info guys

. Guess I'll be putting them on then. I've got some new tie-rods to go with them as well.

e9nine · « **Reply #6 on:** February 04, 2007, 05:09:47 PM »

Quote from: sheepdog;18799

By the way e9ine, zero toe is terrible on your car. When you accelerate, your tires are actually toeing out, making it more difficult to corner. You are killing your mileage, handling, and making things harder on yourself.

Zero toe has always worked fine for my daily driving, auto-x and HPDE application. I got the tip on the zero toe from some "respectable" people and don't see any -ve effects as per your description with regards to those variables.

I have run -ve camber, zero toe and as much caster as possible and my car hasn't ever had any issues cornering. I have had others drive my car and never had any complaints about grip.

I got approx 12 months out of my 17" tires which were used with these settings as I drove the car daily. I say that's not too bad of a compromise

I'll try see if I know anyone running a set up with -ve toe to try and see if I can get a practical "feel" of any differences.

mikesjo · « **Reply #7 on:** February 04, 2007, 05:22:04 PM »

Newbie here. What does camber, caster and toe do. Thought I'd ask since we're on the topic.

Gunni · « **Reply #8 on:** February 04, 2007, 05:34:49 PM »

google is your best friend for "noobie" questions, as they have all been answered before,

e9nine · « **Reply #9 on:** February 04, 2007, 06:06:41 PM »

I might be getting the car corner balanced or at least get the rear alignment set with the Kmac eccentric bushings and I'll check to make sure what the "recommendation" on toe is seeing as the car will see less street use. I like to hear about opinions such as these settings and will obviously jog my mind on the "why" on zero toe. As I pondered on this a bit more - it seems to have been related to "street use" so we'll see if some toe out will help the car or not. I did some searching through my notes and I think s.one who had a track m42 run between 1/16 and 1/8 total toe or so....hmm....

One of my old alignment print outs.

Camber || Caster || Toe

LF -3.5deg || 9.1deg || 0.14deg

RF -3.2deg || 9.1deg || 0.15deg

Alpine003 · « **Reply #10 on:** February 05, 2007, 09:50:13 AM »

I remember someone posting an agressive sport alignment specs on the internet somewhere. A local guy tried this out and worked very well. I do recall him saying there was some agressive toe settings, but he recommended to be very careful driving on the highway as it was very twitchy. But for an auto-x, I guess the added steering assistance can come in handy. I need to find these specs again as I lost all my bookmarks...

e9nine · « **Reply #11 on:** February 05, 2007, 10:19:51 AM »

I would appreciate something if you do find your "cheat sheet"

I am going to use a diff. vehicles for auto-x and track applications. Twitchiness on the highway can go from

to :eek: real quickly with the crazy maniacs out there!

I think my alignment guy might be friendly enough to let me try both configs and decide which settings will work - if I can "mark it" and readjust it for dual purpose (if I end up having to use one car) that would be awesome.

sheepdog · « **Reply #12 on:** February 05, 2007, 07:28:07 PM »

In trade-school I setup a 60's Stang' with 90's Vette' specs... The owner loved it… Drove incredible.

Anyhow, about 1/16 - 1/8in toe in on front should work well on the street. You can go more, but you will start to see tire wear issues begin, I would not go much over 1/4in. unless it is a track car. I am at 3/16 right now if I remember right. Drives well.

Auto literature will tell you to have at least a little toe in (in front) on a rear wheel drive and a little out (on front) on front wheel drive. Squat is not the problem, it is acceleration, the wheels are pushed back by friction, causing a toe-out effect. That is why you toe-in in the first place. More toe helps turn in on cornering. On the rear, toe-out is preferred so that under acceleration they push/pull in. However on some racecars, they even toe in the rear as it really makes a car corner. Basically a driven wheel is toed out, non-driven are toed in, making all things neutral when driving.

Eurospec · « **Reply #13 on:** February 05, 2007, 11:23:01 PM »

OP, you might want to consider AKG's 70A polyurethane non offset bushings if you won't be tracking. I'll say I'm quite satisfied with them. You can read a review in the 'product review' forum on r3v.

mikesjo · « **Reply #14 on:** February 06, 2007, 03:19:46 AM »

Yeah I was looking at those, but then the ride would be a bit stiffer and harsh in the front. It's already harsh enough with the race springs

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