Author Topic: 1991 318is M42, loud clicking (Read 13293 times)

318is93 · « **Reply #15 on:** March 08, 2008, 11:59:03 PM »

Your gears are shot. They shouldn't be pointy at all.
So you'll want to replace the chain, gears, sprockets and rails..
Water pump, thermostat and seals if you havent already..
Thats a 450ish dollar parts bill right there. And whats that ''milky'' looking residue on your valve cover? Have you checked your dipstick for that same thing? You might have a cracked head or bad head gasket. :/

318is93 · « **Reply #16 on:** March 09, 2008, 05:52:50 PM »

You know.. Mine sounds like that but perhaps a bit louder and with more "clacking".
I replaced my oil, oil filter, spark plugs, VC gasket, and timing chain tensioner. Although my gears looked like new.. Do the 93 versions of the M42 have the same oil pan bolt issues though? I don't have a lower or upper it's just the pan.

hoevesruperd · « **Reply #17 on:** March 09, 2008, 06:39:46 PM »

thats scary cause i have a similar sound. just not as loud.. i dont want to go through a 600$ engine job, i'd rather put that money on a stroker i will start working on soon

if the sprockets are pointy and i only replace the tensioner would the engine last another few thousand kms?
(the car has 155k km / 96k miles on the odo)

josephb983 · « **Reply #18 on:** March 10, 2008, 10:22:33 AM »

Quote from: 318is93;44346

Your gears are shot. They shouldn't be pointy at all.
So you'll want to replace the chain, gears, sprockets and rails..
Water pump, thermostat and seals if you havent already..
Thats a 450ish dollar parts bill right there. And whats that ''milky'' looking residue on your valve cover? Have you checked your dipstick for that same thing? You might have a cracked head or bad head gasket. :/

If they are pointy, does that mean they must be replaced? What do the points cause? Or is it a sign of bigger problems?

My oil is good, nothing milky in it at all. Maybe this engine had a head gasket go at one point?

What else should I be checking?

josephb983 · « **Reply #19 on:** March 10, 2008, 10:23:06 AM »

Quote from: shutter;44255

I would guess lifters as well, definitely sounds like a diesel. I'd pull the VC and turn the engine over by hand to watch oil flowing through your lifters. I'd also check/replace your chain tensioner. It is also hydraulic, and mine started to give a whirling sound this Chicago winter when cold. I guess it could be severe chain slap? Mine was more of a whirl. Check your timing gears, mine need replacement at 78k. I also use lighter weight oil in the winter, it helps a lot with cold starts in the severe cold.

Luckily, I've put a total of a 100 miles tops on my car this winter, and that was mostly to my buddies heated garage to work on some stuff =) They salt like crazy here, and I train commute. For the most part, I have a healthy low mileage engine with great compression. It still hates the severe cold starts, and get's a bit loud 15F or colder. I think when I get my timing chain replaced, it will smooth out a bit and a new tensioner helped a ton with noise last time I started it ~10F. I haven't driven much on the new tensioner due to the scary look of my cam sprockets! Moving at the end of the month is setting me back financially on getting the parts I need to put it back into my comfort zone to hit the upper revs...

I figured out how to turn the engine over. What should I look for on the lifters?

How much do lifters cost, if mine are bad?

318is93 · « **Reply #20 on:** March 10, 2008, 02:27:11 PM »

Quote from: josephb983;44434

If they are pointy, does that mean they must be replaced? What do the points cause? Or is it a sign of bigger problems?

My oil is good, nothing milky in it at all. Maybe this engine had a head gasket go at one point?

What else should I be checking?

Yes, pointy is BAD. They should have a flat tip.

hoevesruperd · « **Reply #21 on:** March 10, 2008, 04:06:57 PM »

Quote from: josephb983;44435

I figured out how to turn the engine over. What should I look for on the lifters?

How much do lifters cost, if mine are bad?

from above:

Quote from: 318is93;44283

Around 17 bucks a pop. Try Pelicanparts.com

would it be worth it to go with vw solid lifters, or does that only have a benefit when used in a fully built head?

nomad · « **Reply #22 on:** March 10, 2008, 04:41:35 PM »

I have a full set of lifters from my head that was cracked that i'll part with for cheap.
PM me if you are interested. 130K on them and were working perfectly when taken apart. Not sure what your goal is with your rebuild though...

josephb983 · « **Reply #23 on:** March 11, 2008, 03:02:48 AM »

Update:

I found chunks of chain rollers in the oil pan. The timing chain has no damaged rollers. What could these chunks be from?

Picture of chunks:
http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj142/josephb983/d2165581.jpg

.

josephb983 · « **Reply #24 on:** March 11, 2008, 03:15:45 AM »

Quote from: josephb983;44435

I figured out how to turn the engine over. What should I look for on the lifters?

Anyone?

nomad · « **Reply #25 on:** March 11, 2008, 08:42:35 AM »

Those certainly look like the bearings of the timing chain. You examined the entire chain and there are no missing rollers on every link?

It could be that the timing chain was changed previously and these are remnants of it that have been chilling out.

As for the lifters, from what i know, you have to remove the cams, take off the cam housing and take the lifters out. Clean them up and see if they can be easily depressed. If they can be compressed by hand then they probably don't hold pressure. From the sound in the videos i don't think it's an HLA problem.

If the cam gears are worn out like that then the chain guide rails probably look bad too. There are several plastic lined guides that start to disintegrate over time and could have lost some chunks recently or something got lodged and the chain is rubbing on it.

There is also a small idler wheel along the chain that is supposed to freewheel. It may be the culprit. Maybe it froze up and is dying a horribly loud death? It's under the lower timing cover.

shutter · « **Reply #26 on:** March 11, 2008, 10:05:10 AM »

Sorry, haven't been on the forums for a few days to try to answer your lifter question. I see that it was answered in the other thread. I really think your problem lies more in the timing components. You can find detailed instructions on this job in the E36 service manual available on this site in PDF form. Pretty straightforward, but a big job nonetheless.

josephb983 · « **Reply #27 on:** March 11, 2008, 12:18:27 PM »

Quote from: nomad;44537

You examined the entire chain and there are no missing rollers on every link?

It could be that the timing chain was changed previously and these are remnants of it that have been chilling out.

Yes, examined every link. They may have been in the pan since a previous timing chain.

Quote from: nomad;44537

There is also a small idler wheel along the chain that is supposed to freewheel. It may be the culprit. Maybe it froze up and is dying a horribly loud death? It's under the lower timing cover.

I may want to pull the lower cover, and see if any teeth are missing from the other gears. I was looking at these on realoem, on the diagram for the timing setup.

318is93 · « **Reply #28 on:** March 11, 2008, 04:01:39 PM »

Quote from: josephb983;44570

Yes, examined every link. They may have been in the pan since a previous timing chain.

I may want to pull the lower cover, and see if any teeth are missing from the other gears. I was looking at these on realoem, on the diagram for the timing setup.

I'm in the process of pulling my head off because I can't figure to safe my life what's making my noise. I'm still working on that crank bolt :/

josephb983 · « **Reply #29 on:** March 11, 2008, 08:33:52 PM »

Ok, I shot a couple more videos, with the engine warmed up. I had just driven it on the highway for 20 miles or so. These are my first videos since replacing the tensioner. I did not put the cooling fan back on yet, so these videos were shot w/o the cooling fan.

Made at night, so no visuals. This was shot from directly over the engine, with the hood up:

The video below was made after the one above. The engine sounded slightly smoother,as it had become a bit hot from the revving I think.
Video of tach, with window open and hood up:

These noises get louder when the engine is cold, like in the first videos I made. Notice that they seem tied to certain RPMs, and that they get worse at lower rpms it seems.