Author Topic: Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp (Read 84927 times)

Boyracer · « **Reply #75 on:** March 21, 2008, 11:57:53 AM »

Chip for stock engine is in, air con is out

I haven't weighted air con parts taken out yet but 10 kg seems reasonable guess. I had to retain the retrofit air con heat exhanger/blower (2-3 kg) because stock blower has been removed. I will get original and functioning blower later for fitting.

Fitted chip also, quite easy job. Engine started nicely, rock steady idle instantly. I took the car for short testdrive and I must say I was suprised. Engine does seem to respond better to throttle and there seems to be more grunt on middle revs. What I am certain about is that engine does sound more aggressive and it does rev atleast to 7000. Brother went to testdrive too and he noticed same things so I it is not only my imagination.

Chip is for 98 octane fuel and I still have half a tank of 95 so I will not really push it until refill because of possible knock.

I tried to get time for dyno last week but nearest place that does them arranges certain days for large number of cars to be tested at the same time and none of those days were before easter. So I will have to test stock chip at the same time as current tuning chip.

Tomorrow I will manufacture frame for race seat. And by incredible chance, there is one E36 M42 engine for sale just 30 km away with broken timing chain (bent intake valves). I think I need to buy it

Boyracer · « **Reply #76 on:** April 01, 2008, 08:52:08 AM »

Ok, short update.

I have driven the car with chip for about 1000 km and I have now better idea of it's effects. Consumption on my 400 km "test track" is practically identical, only 2% increase which can be atributed to set of wheels on trunk or bit heavier use of throttle on motorway. So far so good then.

Power/torque is definitely up on middle revs. I can actually use 4th gear to pass things on the road. Overall car feels bit perkier and willing to rev.

Air con removal netted 15.5 kg weight saving, maybe some 4-5 kg more after I get rid of heat exhanger/blower.

Bought the E36 M42 bottom end with clutch, starter and alternator and started taking it apart this weekend. Interestingly it had solid flywheel, I was under impression that in E36 M42 always had dual mass flywheel.

Took two sets of M42 cams for grinding. 220€ / set to get them similar to Shrick cams, only downside is that it will take about two months before they are ready due queue on machnist shop

Major rethink on my plans. There will be two engines:

Engine 1. (current one on car)

- Shrick copy cams
- Motronic chip optimized for Shrick cams
- lightened flywheel
- 2.5" custom made exhaust + cat

Should be around 165-170 hp when ready. This engine will be put on storage once engine 2 is ready.

Engine 2. (one I am going to build based on acquired bottom end)

- W�ssner forged pistons (comp ratio around 12.5)
- bored block to 86 mm
- well balanced crankshaft
- ebay CNC con rods/stock con rods with lightening and shot peening
- S50B30 ITB's
- Mildly modified cylinder head with possible 35 mm intake valves
- Glass/carbon fiber airbox
- Solid valve lifter/follower conversion
- bit stiffer valve springs
- Dbilas, Cat Cams etc cams around 300 degrees duration
- VEMS or Megasquirt engine management
- lightened flywheel from engine 1.
- 2.5" custom made exhaust + cat from engine 1.

Difficult to say about power... Engine should be ok to rev as high as 8500, perhaps even 9000. Honda has similar sized engines and they produce 180 to 240 hp on road trim, altough they have VTEC but on the other hand they do not have ITB's.

I already have most of the parts required by engine 2. but I think it will be one year before it is running...

mkodama · « **Reply #77 on:** April 13, 2008, 07:03:46 PM »

If only S50B30 euro pistons were easier to come by in the U.S.

For inspiration you might want to check out Gizmo's build. He did some similar stuff as you with the M3 pistons.

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=433471&highlight=m42+buildup

ose30 · « **Reply #78 on:** April 14, 2008, 01:50:27 AM »

Quote

Chips. Claims are +15 hp on stock engine and +30 with mild cams. We shall see how it goes...

Somehow those chips (handwriting) looks familiar... I have same manufacturers chips installed into my daily driver (318I / M40).
He promised 12hp over stock 113. I have dynoed car and i got 123hp. I suppose my engines 378.000km's have something to do it

I have also his E30 320IS chips and they work great as well.

Boyracer · « **Reply #79 on:** May 17, 2008, 12:27:38 PM »

Today I bought most parts for 2.5" exhaust and end part of exhaust manifold. Still need some 45 degree turns and well flowing cat. There will be middle resonator and hopefully quiet muffler, I don't like noisy exhausts. All parts are in mild steel, I hope it is easier to work with and does not crack as easily as stainless.

Resonator is model with straight pipe with holes going trough the case which is hopefully filled with nosie absorbing material while muffler is bit more elaborate (there are three chambers and pipes make a few turns) and hopefully more effective.

In his book Graham Bell says 2.5" exhaust is suitable for 180-220 hp which is bit more than I am going to get with this engine (170ish) but it should not be too bad because of mild cams which do not have much overlap. Next engine hopefully will be in upper part of that range and I do not want to build new exhaust for it.

Went to dyno too week ago and entered data to excel:

(stock data is from BMW papers, not from this exact engine or dyno)

Received one M62B44 intake valve and it should be possible to use it on M42 after bit of modifications. Valve is 2,5 mm shorter than M42 valve but it is 35 mm vs 33 mm in diameter, woot!

nuvolarossa · « **Reply #80 on:** May 17, 2008, 01:41:51 PM »

what about s65 (E92 M3) intake valves? 5mm valve steam 35,7mm diameter and they are 15€ from the dealer... dunno about lenght...
http://bmwfans.info/original/E92/Cou/M3-S65/ECE/L/N/2007/06/mg-11/ill-11_4124/

Boyracer · « **Reply #81 on:** May 17, 2008, 02:09:53 PM »

Yeah, I think I will order one for measurements since they are cheap. Not sure how difficult it would be to find 5 mm valve guides that fir M42 head, BMW does not seem to sell valve guides...

dublinboy · « **Reply #82 on:** May 20, 2008, 12:58:50 PM »

Quote from: AL GReeNeRy;27653

these goals are very reasonable and are actually what i hope to accomplish with my m42 as well. other than the option of the DASC, i wanted to reach the 200hp as mark as well. your setup sounds similar to what i would be running. ill do a quick run down.

engine
stock bottom end
rebuilt head with cams and proper valvetrain
completely rebuilt timing equipment
a maf setup with MS or some sort of tuning

drivetrain
8lb. m20 ltwt flywheel
new stock m20 clutch if not a stage 1
med. case 4.10 LSD
z4 3.0 ssk
uuc dssr

exhaust
custom 2.5" from centerpiece back (after 2-1)
electronic exhaust cutout before cat which will be replaced with a resonator

i believe our best bet would be tuning. bmws are known for being well underrated. if you can unleash its true potential by fine tuning the computer, 200hp is easily achievable.

if the bottom end is tinkered with, the whole process will be much easier.

i need help!!!! maybe you can help me,
first off i own a 318is e30. I found out the cylinder head was cracked and im finding it very difficult to replace it here in ireland.
so, as a last resort, im now thinking off dropping a 325i e30 engine in it and i was wondering what else i would need to make sure the engine runs right. wat else do i need?
example;
ecu
gearbox
brakes

?
thanks

mkodama · « **Reply #83 on:** May 20, 2008, 05:12:43 PM »

Quote from: dublinboy;49756

i need help!!!! maybe you can help me,
first off i own a 318is e30. I found out the cylinder head was cracked and im finding it very difficult to replace it here in ireland.
so, as a last resort, im now thinking off dropping a 325i e30 engine in it and i was wondering what else i would need to make sure the engine runs right. wat else do i need?
example;
ecu
gearbox
brakes
?
thanks

This is probably the wrong thread for that question. Do a search, there is a lot of information out there. If my neighbor has a 318 and a 325 sitting side by side, he can do an engine swap in a weekend, so it's not too bad.

Boyracer · « **Reply #84 on:** May 21, 2008, 06:34:04 AM »

Just picked up my reground camshafts. Machinist told me that they are very close to Shrick specs, maybe with a 0.05 - 0,1 mm more lift and few degrees more duration, depending on how Shrick measures their parameters.

Aaaaaahhhh black beauties...

Now I have the cams (I will sell the extra pair) and I have the chip, just need to find time and place to perform the swap and then I'm off to dyno again

ose30 · « **Reply #85 on:** May 21, 2008, 07:56:53 AM »

Were they done in Finland? If so, what company did you use?

Boyracer · « **Reply #86 on:** May 21, 2008, 08:14:12 AM »

Yes, they were done in company called Kylm�kosken Erikoismoottori and I luckily live some 50 km away from there so I could just go there and have a chat with the guy. He also recommended a a good place for cylinderhead work and that is only 5 km away from my home

RouteZeroDesign · « **Reply #87 on:** May 21, 2008, 01:27:16 PM »

Dublinboy-
Welcome, but your first post really should have been more relevant to the thread. I know your only looking for help but its much easier just to start your own thread.

If your looking for a replacement engine, or a new m42/44 (which will be much better in my opinion) then check out http://www.traynors.co.uk. They are the largest second hand parts dealer in Ireland and the UK. They deliver parts to the coachmans inn near the airport, every friday and wednesday, very early in the morning.
They will sort you out with a replacement engine, or if your doing a swap, they will tell you what you need. They are honest and wont try sell you something that you dont need.
If you need any more help just start a new thread in this section, for the sake of convenience and respect to Boyracer

Boyracer
Sorry if you covered it already but what are the specs of the cam?
Did the company provide you with a profile sheet?
and how much would you be willing to sell the spare set for?

BTW: Your project is progessing very nicely

I wish i could say the same for my own, but at the moment im just fixing problems and planning, rather than modifying. The current problem is a hole in the exhaust

Boyracer · « **Reply #88 on:** May 21, 2008, 04:25:10 PM »

Quote from: RouteZeroDesign;49819

Sorry if you covered it already but what are the specs of the cam?
Did the company provide you with a profile sheet?
and how much would you be willing to sell the spare set for?

BTW: Your project is progessing very nicely
I wish i could say the same for my own, but at the moment im just fixing problems and planning, rather than modifying. The current problem is a hole in the exhaust

Look here:

http://www.avl-schrick.com/dat/MK/AVL_SCHRICK_2008_E.pdf

There's only one cam for M42 on that list. In short it is 256 degrees and 10,4 mm of lift. Sorry no profile sheet from the grinder, pretty much all I can do is to check the lift...

Well my project has been going on for atleast a year so it was a high time that something started to happen. And you need to study a bit if you are not too familiar with the engines like me

mkodama · « **Reply #89 on:** May 21, 2008, 07:17:21 PM »

Quote from: Boyracer;49793

Mmm... Sexy...

Author Topic: Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp (Read 84927 times)

Boyracer

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

Boyracer

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

mkodama

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

ose30

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

Boyracer

exhausted!

nuvolarossa

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

Boyracer

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

dublinboy

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

mkodama

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

Boyracer

Shafted!

ose30

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

Boyracer

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

RouteZeroDesign

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

Boyracer

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp

mkodama

Buildup: My quest for NA 180 hp