Camshaft position sensor code (1244) - but replaced sensor!!!

[ohnoes]

Hey all,

So I posted this on Bf.C, but I figured more specifically, posting on the M42-only forum might be a good idea, too, since y'all know the M42-specific glitches, tips, and tricks.

So for a couple months, I have been experiencing a sometimes-severe bucking and hesitation problem, especially when it's wet outside, and I didn't know what it was caused by, but it was certainly kinda scary to be accelerating on the main thoroughfare and be bucking about like a rodeo horse.

Usually, while and only while this was happening, the CEL would come on. Then it would promptly disappear when the engine combusted normally again, usually after a second or two.


As I was a car noob at the time, and still am, my mechanic apparently knew the gas pedal-diagnostic test, and he said it was throwing two codes: O2 sensor, and camshaft position sensor (IIRC). But then he said it wasn't the O2 sensor code, just the camshaft position sensor code, that he had misinterpreted the computer.

Then the CEL went away while driving, but came back while simply sitting at idle, i.e. traffic lights and while waiting to pick someone up, etc.! When I pressed the gas above 2,000 RPM, it would go away, then come back about 15 seconds later. Another mechanic and I discovered that the crankcase vacuum hose was completely disconnected!!! So I bought the hose, connected it, and all was fine for a while.

Then I started having this bucking and hesitating problem again, and we replaced the camshaft position sensor, as per the code it would throw while I experienced the problem--1244.

Now the car will occasionally, but less often, buck, and just five days ago it stalled on me completely while driving at a low speed in a residential neighborhood! I pulled it over, and it WOULD NOT start. It seemed to crank and spark (well, I didn't check spark...) and even SORT OF started, but then it would get bogged down in what sounded like fuel and simply die.

The engine threw the SAME, CAMSHAFT POSITION SENSOR code that we had BEFORE replacing it, when the car stalled like this.

I left it there overnight and my mechanic towed it the next morning.

Guess what? He said it was PERFECTLY NORMAL and drove it around all day on various errands.

This car is so frustrating. What could it be that is causing a CAMSHAFT POSITION SENSOR code but yet we replaced that sensor???

I have read somewhere that actually, a faulty crankshaft position sensor might cause the camshaft position sensor code, since they are fairly similar sensors, and both Hall Effect, IIRC...? Anyone know whether or not this is true?

ANY help whatsoever would be appreciated. I need to figure this out ASAP!

Thanks in advance!

[ohnoes]

Well, I ran Seafoam through my gas tank yesterday and all I can say is the car is running better than ever!!! Much smoother, likes to rev more, and is generally much better. I'm not sure how long it will LAST, but it leads me to believe that maybe it was a stuck-open injector that was throwing off the timing of the combustion cycle, which in turn messed up the camshaft position sensor signal, which in turn threw a code and caused misfires.

Sound plausible?

[ohnoes]

Please... can anyone help?

The car stalled on me today while turning onto my street. Was shifting into second and it just died. Finally started back up again after about a half dozen times. Died again when I got to my house--right in front of my driveway, blocking our other cars. Had to let it roll back (luckily, there is a hill; thank god for gravity) and press the brakes pretty hard to stop it in front of my house 'cause of the snow. This is simply unacceptable.

What could it be? I am still getting the camshaft position sensor code!!!

If this helps, when I got it back started, it was running perfectly fine. BUT, when I floor the gas from idle, EVERY SINGLE TIME, the CEL comes on and it misfires, then the CEL goes off, and it comes back to idle. But when it comes back to idle, it goes kinda low and the car shakes/rumbles a little bit, and then it resumes normal idling.

ANY SUGGESTIONS WOULD BE SO APPRECIATED. I CANNOT DRIVE MY CAR UNTIL I FIX THIS PROBLEM.

Thanks!!!!!!

[kowalski]

could be either the ecu, or did you check for a loose connection where the cam sensor plugs in. there is a wiring harness there, and it could have some loose connections developed in it over the past number of years.

[ohnoes]

Thanks for your response, dude! Much appreciated.

Hmm, no, I didn't check for a loose connection there, but doesn't it just stick in and it's secured by a bolt? This is a brand new sensor, new wire, etc.

How would I check the ECU? Could it also be the DME?

Also, I've read that a crankshaft position sensor can cause a camshaft position sensor code. Any clue if this is indeed true?

[D. Clay]

I would start with inspecting all hoses for leaks. While it's running normally, spray WD-40 on the vacuum and pollution hoses. This will change the speed of the idle as the leak is temporarily plugged by the WD-40. Check all of the wires and connectors for cracked insulation, places where they could rub on the motor and ground, loose plugs, etc. These are 15+ year old cars and a lot of weird stuff can happen that is real obvious once you find it. Rubber and vinyl under the hood go through a gazillion heat cycles in 15 years.

[ohnoes]

So you think vacuum leaks could be causing the camshaft position sensor code to be thrown?

Worth a looksie, I suppose. I don't even know where most of the vacuum hoses are. There seem to be so many beneath the actual engine and stuff; or maybe those are other types of hoses.  And aren't there more beneath the intake manifold and other hard-to-access places?

Seems like there's dozens of hoses down there... this is gonna be tricky.

Thanks for the responses thus far!!! Much appreciated again.

[D. Clay]

and/or wiring. I had a temp gauge wire short intermittently once. There is also wiring to the sensors.

[ohnoes]

and/or wiring. I had a temp gauge wire short intermittently once. There is also wiring to the sensors.

Explain? Like where is this wiring, and how would I go about testing all the wiring continuity. Sounds like a huge/tedious job!

[kowalski]

i did not mean check for a loose connection where the sensor bolts in, but where it plugs in on the other end. that wiring harness is mounted to the engine and gets a lot of vibrations, chances are good that there is a loose connection there.

out of curriosity does anyone know what makes the CEL flash a cam sensor code? where does it get its information from to decided that its a cam sensor?

[ohnoes]

i did not mean check for a loose connection where the sensor bolts in, but where it plugs in on the other end. that wiring harness is mounted to the engine and gets a lot of vibrations, chances are good that there is a loose connection there.

Ah, I see what you're saying. But we replaced that sensor. You're saying that a) the previous sensor may not have been bad, and b) it may just be a loose connection?

I tried to wiggle the sensor, and it wiggled only a tiny bit, but not enough to make me think it is losing electrical contact. Maybe it is, though. How would I tell???

I also tried to wiggle the connectors (there are two, it seems??? Which is kinda odd, since there is only one sensor...) on what I presume is the DME--that long, black box running along/partially underneath the engine block (?). They wiggled substantially.

I wanted to try disconnecting the connectors on the DME and see if that would replicate the problem every time. If so, well folks, we have our answer. But alas, I didn't want to break anything so I didn't pull too hard to get 'em out. There might be a bolt or something I'm not seeing.

BTW, my car was running perfect in the neighborhood until it got fully warmed up. Then, as I was making a right-hand turn at a stop sign up an incline, and pressed the gas rather hard, the CEL flashed and the engine misfired, but DID NOT stall. When it came back to idle, it rumbled and came too a low idle, then went back up to normal idle speed.

I can replicate the CEL/misfire almost every time as follows:

1) Idle, fully warmed-up engine (must  be at idle). I have not tried this test with a cold engine; I suppose I should. I have a feeling it will do the same thing.
2) Press gas quickly and substantially ONCE so that revs go above 1,000 RPM but below about 2,500 RPM. A slight tap will not produce the desired effect.
3) CEL usually flashes and car usually misfires.
4) When engine comes back to idle, it goes to about 550 RPM (lower than it should), car rumbles, wants to stall or something, but catches itself virtually every time.
5) Conduct gas pedal OBDI diagnostic.
6) CEL flashes 1244, signifying "camshaft position sensor."

I have about a 60-70% "success" rate in replicating the problem with the above process.

Does it still sound like a camshaft position sensor?

out of curriosity does anyone know what makes the CEL flash a cam sensor code? where does it get its information from to decided that its a cam sensor?

This is what I want to know, too!

[ohnoes]

UPDATE:

The car is sitting at the $tealership right now. The technician showed me that the computer (special dealership computer) is only detecting that ONE fault--camshaft "pulse generator," as they call it.

He told me he can't test it because it's not an OEM part. I ordered it from Pelican Parts, and it's manufactured by Facet, which IIRC, is a German brand. But he's saying he can't even test the sensor because it's not OEM. Anyone know if this is true? Don't see how it could be, but meh...

So basically he's implying that I have to spend $130 to buy another one of these damn sensors from the dealer and have him install it, and hope the problem goes away. If it doesn't, he said it might be a vacuum leak, or coils or something.

I just hope he can figure it out. I'm not paying these "experts" $115/hr for nothing.

What do you guys think?

[kowalski]

uhh... the sensor would have to be the same as OEM otherwise it wouldn't work on the car... so if he can't test it its not the right sensor for the car... the computer wont adapt to other sensors. Basically either you got the wrong part and some how it plugged in, or the mechanic is so full of shit its coming out his mouth.

[ohnoes]

uhh... the sensor would have to be the same as OEM otherwise it wouldn't work on the car... so if he can't test it its not the right sensor for the car... the computer wont adapt to other sensors. Basically either you got the wrong part and some how it plugged in, or the mechanic is so full of shit its coming out his mouth.

He said because it's not genuine BMW stuff, they can't do proper tests on it because they don't know its specs. I sniffed BS, too, but I couldn't imagine hearing blatant BS from a STEP-certified, BMW veteran mechanic as this guy seemed to be.

I called Pelican Parts, either way, and if they allow me to return the sensor, which they probably won't unless it's certifiably defective, as per their return policy, it will only run me an extra $50 to get the genuine BMW one, which the dealer is obsessing over.

Total parts and labor for this sensor at the dealer: $230.

Ridiculous, but meh.

And you know what they want for control arms and control arm bushings, with parts and labor? $900. WTF?!!!?! Needless to say, I won't be paying that. They want me to also do sway bar links and tie rod assemblies, as they say these can easily contribute to severe braking vibrations, which I have. But I just got brand new brake pads and rotors, so maybe the rotors are warped...

[romkasponka]

These sensors is quite sensitive when gap between cam tooth and sensor is not right. This is magnetic pickup sensor. Try google to finde some aftermaket ecu manual for correct gap. Messure yours. I had the same problems, my engine was working event without it, but the power was less than it should be, I replaced the o ring with new and fault disappeared

Good luck..