help with no start issue e30 318is

[jammz23]

What's up guys Im having a slight issue with my car. I just picked up a 1991 318is. Bought it not running and it was sitting for about a year according to the PO. I've checked resistance on the cam sensor (0Ohms) and crank (550ohms~). From what I understand they will still start with a faulty cam sensor, correct me if I'm wrong. I've jumped the fuel pump relay and it just turns over never catches.Tomorrow im going to check for spark but there is power to the coil packs. I did get a new crankshaft position sensor I'll be trying out in the morning with the cam sensor coming in a few days... any pointers or leads anyone can help me out with? Kinda new to the m42 and what not.. all help and or tips/suggestions are greatly appreciated thank you!!!!

[DesktopDave]

You've done everything I'd have done, that's for sure. The fuel pump runs and you have power at the coils. I'd borrow a pressure tester and jump both main & FP relays while testing...just to be sure. I'd also test the other wire pairs of the sensors (2,3 & 1,3) as they can short internally. Those type of sensors require very high resistance to protect the timing signal. I'd test the new sensor as well, I bought one a while back that was bad out of the box.

If you have an E30, the crank sensor requires removal of the A/C compressor and bracket, here's a diagram. You can't get at the (six?) bracket bolts unless you do. Dumb design on BMWs part.

[jammz23]

You've done everything I'd have done, that's for sure. The fuel pump runs and you have power at the coils. I'd borrow a pressure tester and jump both main & FP relays while testing...just to be sure. I'd also test the other wire pairs of the sensors (2,3 & 1,3) as they can short internally. Those type of sensors require very high resistance to protect the timing signal. I'd test the new sensor as well, I bought one a while back that was bad out of the box.

If you have an E30, the crank sensor requires removal of the A/C compressor and bracket, here's a diagram. You can't get at the (six?) bracket bolts unless you do. Dumb design on BMWs part.

thanks for the response!

how would i go about testing the relays?
and pressure tester for compression or fuel pressure?

on the new crank sensor i got around 810 Ohms with the old reading 550~.

I read from another user that 800 Ohms from the CPS was actually causing an issue even though the sensor was brand new.

problem was solved by buying a bmw branded sensor

[DesktopDave]

Crank sensor should be 680 +/- 10%...somewhere between 600 and 725 ohms is the specification. From my experience it's usually on the high side of that range, ~700 ohms or so.

I usually test relays by the process of elimination. I'll swap in a known-good relay or make a few jumper wires and put them in the sockets, if that solves the problem then the relay is probably bad.

Fuel pressure testing requires a bit of high-pressure fuel hose and a pressure gauge. The most accurate test is to 'tee' it off the fuel line on the supply side. You should see about 43psi if everything is OK. Don't test it off the FPR return line, you'll get incorrect readings. If you don't have a tee, you can dead-head the supply line with the gauge. It's not a 100% accurate test, but a healthy fuel pump can push 80psi of pressure against the gauge.

Compression testers are usually available for rent at auto parts stores. You pull the plugs, then thread the compression adapter in. A healthy engine piston should generate about 160~200psi IIRC. Those gauges aren't all that accurate, so consistent readings are more important. All four cylinders should be read within a few psi of each other...about 5% difference is OK.

[jammz23]

Crank sensor should be 680 +/- 10%...somewhere between 600 and 725 ohms is the specification. From my experience it's usually on the high side of that range, ~700 ohms or so.

I usually test relays by the process of elimination. I'll swap in a known-good relay or make a few jumper wires and put them in the sockets, if that solves the problem then the relay is probably bad.

Fuel pressure testing requires a bit of high-pressure fuel hose and a pressure gauge. The most accurate test is to 'tee' it off the fuel line on the supply side. You should see about 43psi if everything is OK. Don't test it off the FPR return line, you'll get incorrect readings. If you don't have a tee, you can dead-head the supply line with the gauge. It's not a 100% accurate test, but a healthy fuel pump can push 80psi of pressure against the gauge.

Compression testers are usually available for rent at auto parts stores. You pull the plugs, then thread the compression adapter in. A healthy engine piston should generate about 160~200psi IIRC. Those gauges aren't all that accurate, so consistent readings are more important. All four cylinders should be read within a few psi of each other...about 5% difference is OK.

thanks again for the reply

after running some tests heres what i got

CPS: 547 ohms
CaMSen: 1307 kohms (seems off)
coolant temp sensor: 1.9 kohms @ 81*F

car started with starter fluid, sounded a little rough but its sat for almost 2 years (spark and no fuel?)

verified main relay and fuel pump relay are fine using e36 bentley manual

fuel pump doesn't run while cranking? (many say they run while cranking)

battery ran outta juice so it's on a charger now to be ready for compression test tmrw as well as fuel pressure test

several vacuum leaks, replacing hoses circled in pictures below as they are all bad








also, what is this part? i seen no reference to it


i'm putting the order in for the hoses tomorrow. is there anything else not listed that could cause a no start issue? i'm hoping its all the leaks combined causing a problem but would that cause the fuel pump not to run while cranking? thanks in advance

[Tgoode318]

make sure you thoroughly test your battery for proper functionality. You would be surprised how many people jump the gun and start replacing stuff/doing way more work then they have to only to find its a dead bat.   

[keflaman]

This thread will help you decide whether or not you want to order all those hoses, or perform the "Mess Under The Intake" mod. Item #7 is a plate that hot water runs through that many people think prevents "carb ice"...I believe it's for emissions.

http://www.m42club.com/forum/index.php?topic=2742.0

[cristimm]

also, what is this part? i seen no reference to it

That is a heater for the throttle body, same as part 3 from the same picture. It can work just fine without it. I had them both in my 318is E36.

[jammz23]

This thread will help you decide whether or not you want to order all those hoses, or perform the "Mess Under The Intake" mod. Item #7 is a plate that hot water runs through that many people think prevents "carb ice"...I believe it's for emissions.

http://www.m42club.com/forum/index.php?topic=2742.0

So in conclusion, the fuel pump wiring was backwards and all rigged up. Majority of all hoses were replaced, as well as the fuel filter, water pump, thermostat, tie rod ends, and slave cylinder. Car is running like brand new, shifts like a beauty.

Unfortunately on my lunch break a couple of days ago, I went to unlock the door and the key snapped on me and it's stuck deep in there. Places are charging me up to $200 just to remove the broken piece from inside the lock, even had my insurance locksmith come and he couldn't get the job done.

I've done read ups on how to rebuild the lock cylinder and what not but as of right now I'm just a little confused as to which route I want to take. I work over 50 hours a week so it's kinda hard keeping up with all this stuff especially when you're at work and can't really do anything.

BMW makes replacement OEM keys for $95 and it takes up to 3 days, so let's see what i'll do tomorrow.. Any suggestions??


Other than that, the car has been great for the most part driving great I put brand new tires on the basket BBS and she's doing alright, just a bit of a hassle and set back with this broken key issue now 

[colin86325]

Can you unlock it from the trunk, or was that your only key?

[Nick_318is]

The lock rebuild kit is the way I'd go. You can easily do it in less than an hour, there should be a number of good write ups out there.
http://www.billswebspace.com/BMWE30DoorPanelRemoval-LockCylinderRebuild.htm

[DesktopDave]

So in conclusion, the fuel pump wiring was backwards and all rigged up. Majority of all hoses were replaced, as well as the fuel filter, water pump, thermostat, tie rod ends, and slave cylinder. Car is running like brand new, shifts like a beauty.

Awesome! Glad to hear it.

Unfortunately on my lunch break a couple of days ago, I went to unlock the door and the key snapped on me and it's stuck deep in there. Places are charging me up to $200 just to remove the broken piece from inside the lock, even had my insurance locksmith come and he couldn't get the job done.

I've done read ups on how to rebuild the lock cylinder and what not but as of right now I'm just a little confused as to which route I want to take. I work over 50 hours a week so it's kinda hard keeping up with all this stuff especially when you're at work and can't really do anything.

BMW makes replacement OEM keys for $95 and it takes up to 3 days, so let's see what i'll do tomorrow.. Any suggestions??

First, go tell BMW that they can go f*** themselves over that little bit of extortion/incompetence. $95 to cut a key with a three day wait? I've owned ten BMWs but I've been in a dealer twice in the last thirty years (I meet my buddy there sometimes after work, he's a BMW Master Tech). Someone has to pay for that nice big building with the pretty receptionist, overpaid sales staff and free latte...don't be that person. BMW does NOT want to work on anything less than ten years old, and most certainly does NOT deserve your patronage. I appreciate their efforts to keep old parts in production, but their dealers are virtually useless for owners like us.

You can fix the lock if it isn't too bad, but you have to take the inner panel off the door. The way that I'd do it, is to drill a hole in the center rear of the cylinder, then use a small drift to push the broken key out of the cylinder. Once you have the two pieces of the key, see if your local locksmith can help you out. It might be possible for him to use just the broken part to cut a few copies.

[jammz23]

So in conclusion, the fuel pump wiring was backwards and all rigged up. Majority of all hoses were replaced, as well as the fuel filter, water pump, thermostat, tie rod ends, and slave cylinder. Car is running like brand new, shifts like a beauty.

Awesome! Glad to hear it.

Unfortunately on my lunch break a couple of days ago, I went to unlock the door and the key snapped on me and it's stuck deep in there. Places are charging me up to $200 just to remove the broken piece from inside the lock, even had my insurance locksmith come and he couldn't get the job done.

I've done read ups on how to rebuild the lock cylinder and what not but as of right now I'm just a little confused as to which route I want to take. I work over 50 hours a week so it's kinda hard keeping up with all this stuff especially when you're at work and can't really do anything.

BMW makes replacement OEM keys for $95 and it takes up to 3 days, so let's see what i'll do tomorrow.. Any suggestions??

First, go tell BMW that they can go f*** themselves over that little bit of extortion/incompetence. $95 to cut a key with a three day wait? I've owned ten BMWs but I've been in a dealer twice in the last thirty years (I meet my buddy there sometimes after work, he's a BMW Master Tech). Someone has to pay for that nice big building with the pretty receptionist, overpaid sales staff and free latte...don't be that person. BMW does NOT want to work on anything less than ten years old, and most certainly does NOT deserve your patronage. I appreciate their efforts to keep old parts in production, but their dealers are virtually useless for owners like us.

You can fix the lock if it isn't too bad, but you have to take the inner panel off the door. The way that I'd do it, is to drill a hole in the center rear of the cylinder, then use a small drift to push the broken key out of the cylinder. Once you have the two pieces of the key, see if your local locksmith can help you out. It might be possible for him to use just the broken part to cut a few copies.

Yea boss thanks again for all the help and tips and what not, much appreciated from down here in Florida!

I dropped the whole lock cylinder and took it apart and finally yanked out the other piece of the key with small little knife sticks with teeth to pull it out. Took me a good 15 minutes playing with it but finally got it. Took it over to ACE hardware and they were not able to get any grip on the teeth of the old key (it was fairly worn and dull). So I took the route of BMW and man for $69 they shipped me just the bare metal stick with no top, barely ant grip to handle or anything. They said that the top plastic attachment with the light at the tip was an extra $65 if I wanted it hahahaha i've seen the full thing on ebay with the light on it for $30 so I may just order another blank copy with it and call it a day with BMW all they do is TAX PEOPLE it's wrong, but hey I really had no other choice, it is what it is today I finally drove the car to work today and she felt great.


I will keep this post updated whenever I have the chance and what not, I do have a couple of plans for the vehicle so let's see what comes next!

[jammz23]

What's going on guys.... So I drove the car from Ft Myers all the way to Orlando FL 2 days ago (280 miles or so), went to go visit some family. She drove like a champ there and I checked everything to make sure it was on point before heading back last night...

So she drove great for the majority of the ride back home, but unfortunately about 30 minutes before getting back home the car started choking up, whenever I would try to step on the gas too much it would choke up, but if I cruised on 70mph it didn't really do it or didn't do it at all. I parked the car last night and I've been at work since then (got a ride this morning). I was thinking the fuel pump was on its way out, but don't want to jump that far ahead just yet..

TB bad? MAF? Gaskets? Will be looking for any leads and/or diagnostics tomorrow hence I requested the day off to resolve this issue, and keep this updated as well... Any suggestions?


P.S. Also.... The car when I fuel up fully, it smells like gas pretty strongly.... Canister maybe is bad? Any tips? All help and/or advice is welcome and greatly appreciated.

[DesktopDave]

I'd do a fuel pressure & flow test to see what's really going on with that system. Check the fuse, the relay and the flow. Have you jumped the pump at the relay socket to see if that solves the problem?

Many parts shops will rent a pressure gauge for free (Advance Auto for instance). Be sure to perform a flow test. Bentley suggests 43psi and about 1/2 gallon/minute (about a quart/liter every 30 seconds). Fuel pump should pull no more than five amps. If you tee the fuel gauge, you should see 43psi on the rail. If you dead-head the pump, you might see 80 psi if it's healthy.

You don't see any leaks when the car is cold, do you? I've had fuel leaks under the intake manifold that caused hard starting before. It's these two short lengths between the hard lines and the fuel rail here. They are not visible with the upper intake installed. Usually I just got a little whiff of gas on cold starts.

As for the full tank leak - check the o-ring on the fuel pump housing. Part #7 here.