Author Topic: Warsteiner, Wazzu70 and bmwman91 convince Norm he can build a smoking M42 (Read 26288 times)

Warsteiner · « **Reply #75 on:** March 30, 2014, 08:09:29 AM »

Bmwman91: Those are 45mm custom slides that I had made from the guy that used to work for Schnitzer and built all of Ravaglia�s engines back in the day. I have seen your CAD renditions of the throttles you�re talking about awhile back. I�m guessing that the race teams would already be using them if they would make a difference. Maybe they just haven�t thought of it and you�re on to something? Lol
PS. this thread seems to be all your fault�.LOL

MLM: I sent you a PM awhile back�lol

Norm: well�.where to start? 2.1L? How many cc�s is that cuz i�m at 2045cc so I�m a 2.045L . I think if you are above 2050cc you can call yourself a 2.1L..LMAO You�d better go with the M47 and at least 86.4mm S52 pistons to put you in the 2064cc or �2.1L� group�..

romkasponka is right about the atomization for the extra inj�s.

Here�s some info that I got from PLek about the slide throttles. This particular set up has to be tuned with Alpha N. Reason being that there is no vacuum to be taken from all 4 cylinders individually like the ITB�s. When running these slides you need inj�s in the 300-550cc range depending on the size of your engine. Now, he didn�t make clear what the Secondary injector size was. But on the single stage he recommended the Volvo 2300 turbo inj which I�ve researched to be the 0280150357 at about 294cc�s but you would need to change the wiring since that is a low impedance inj. I have these inj�s running on my S14 and have had them flowed at over 300cc�s. The equivalent to to that in a high impedance is the 0280150785 at about 308cc�s. He actually said that tuning the slides is not that difficult. But here is the kicker� The fuel pressure needs to be at 4 Bar minimum. So your 300cc turns into about 350cc�s. More is better when it comes to fuel on these and you can always tune out the excess.

I�m pretty sure he was talking about a stock motor when he said running the Schrick 256 cams and slides you can tweak 170HP at the crank out of it.

He said the slides work differently than the ITB�s. The slides need more fuel injected faster and directly and using a small injector isn�t going to cut it. They�re normally used for track use and using them on the street may not be practical and jerky. LOL
But we have a guy in Germany running slides on a street 2.7L S14 and no issues whatsoever. I think it�s all in how you tune it. I do believe he is still on the stock ECU as well for the Timing but runs a piggyback set up for the Fuel. He does have access to a dyno and is in tight with BMW Motorsport so he has lots of resources.

So I�m thinking we should all get slides and test them out at various stages. Who�s in?�..hahaha
And no Norm I�m not buying them for everyone! LOL

Cheers,
~Ralph

normboudreault · « **Reply #76 on:** March 30, 2014, 08:29:45 AM »

Well I'll be happy with 2.0L... Im leaning towards the M44 crank as we havent quantified the advantage of the M47 route...just saying...

Ralph: ITB's, slides...you guys are so far ahead of me here... why don't you come over and help me paint my new garage first...

romkasponka · « **Reply #77 on:** March 30, 2014, 09:42:49 AM »

As I know if you run very wild cams you cannot use vacuum because it is very unstable/pulsating and even if you will make restrictor in sense line you will get signal which will be delayed and not so usable. It is better to use just atmospheric pressure corrections and alpha N. Slide throttles are better because when they are WOT there is nothing in the way of airflow.

For my engine I am thinking to go for 145mm (in standard engine they was fitted to m52b20tu as I remember) rods (probably pauter) and m42 or m44 crank with custom supertech or JE two rings piston. In this case you can make piston shorter and lighter and longer rod.

wazzu70 · « **Reply #78 on:** March 30, 2014, 12:14:17 PM »

Quote from: normboudreault on March 30, 2014, 08:29:45 AM

Well I'll be happy with 2.0L... Im leaning towards the M44 crank as we havent quantified the advantage of the M47 route...just saying...

Look at the MM brochure: http://www.metricmechanic.com/pdf/M42-Engine-Booklet.pdf

The engine using the 88mm M47 crank is making 15 lb-ft with more radical cams that will reduce the torque. Its clear the 88mm crank adds some good grunt to the engine. Unfortunately I am not aware of a comparison that has just the 88mm crank with lighter duty cams to compare directly with the 83.5mm crank engine.

As far as the engine management goes, you can use anything that will allow you to reach your goal. One method has only a few people who can adjust your calibration, the other can be adjusted by multiple people. That's how I view it anyway. The key is to figure out who you want to do the tuning, and ask them what their preference is. You will ALWAYS get better results that way.

If you are interested in doing it yourself, standalone is the only good path at the moment. Going that route requires you to have a good amount of knowledge, or be willing to learn a lot. If you want things to be more of a plug in and go....the tuned stock ECU is your best bet.

wazzu70 · « **Reply #79 on:** March 30, 2014, 12:21:39 PM »

Here is a link to the thread where I kind of documented my build. If you search my username on E30tech you can find the longer build thread.

http://www.m42club.com/forum/index.php?topic=14777.15

Warsteiner · « **Reply #80 on:** August 01, 2015, 11:23:11 AM »

Ok, It's time Norm! You should build a really healthy M42 Stroker or , I'll have to race you for pinks against your M3 with my M42! LMAO

So, just a quick update on my car and I would love to find that Dyno thread that I think Matt started, but I can't seem to find it $:-\$

Displacement 2045cc Bore 86mm x Stroke 88mm
Compression Ratio 10.9:1 
Horsepower 212 @ 6875 
Torque 163 @ 4175 172 @ 5950

The torque band is pretty flat from 4,000 to 6,800rpm. I'd say thats a very useable power band. Rev limit is 7,200

Or you could just buy my M3 and big the king of the hill with 300+HP!! LOL

Up to you

Cheers,
~Ralph

sh123 · « **Reply #81 on:** August 01, 2015, 11:50:21 AM »

Warsteiner, have you got a build thread for me to have a read through?
Cheers
Sion

Warsteiner · « **Reply #82 on:** August 01, 2015, 12:28:22 PM »

Not yet Sion. It's a really cool build and I've done a lot of things that people say can't be done or won't or might not work. So I'll get some info together and post it, but in the meantime you can ask all the questions you want

This may also help get Norm's list together for the parts he'd like to use on his build

Cheers,
~Ralph

MLM · « **Reply #83 on:** August 01, 2015, 10:14:22 PM »

Quote from: Warsteiner on August 01, 2015, 11:23:11 AM

So, just a quick update on my car and I would love to find that Dyno thread that I think Matt started

Cheers,
~Ralph

Tis here
http://www.m42club.com/forum/index.php?topic=18772.0
Reference forum in hindsight was prob not the best place for it..

sh123 · « **Reply #84 on:** August 02, 2015, 04:02:45 PM »

My main worries at the moment are what to do about oil pressure ie do i need to run higher oil pressure being a competition engine? Different oil pump?

Have you done anything with water pump?

I personally am cheating and sending engine away to be built due to it being for competition use i dont want to cut corners etc.

Anybody know what valves mm run? I know they run 6mm stems but they dont mention 34/35 inlet valves

Darky · « **Reply #85 on:** August 02, 2015, 08:09:01 PM »

Hi Ralph

212 hp from 10.9:1 2050 cm m42 is huge! Well done
What valves, inlet manifold and exhaust are you using?

Cheers Rohan

normboudreault · « **Reply #86 on:** August 03, 2015, 07:41:21 AM »

Ralph,

Now I get your text I just read!

Was at work this weekend...

Wish I were still planning a big build for the M42 but if I go that route I will have to stall the project for a good long while to pay for it all...

Anyone willing to donate parts??

Warsteiner · « **Reply #87 on:** August 03, 2015, 07:51:30 AM »

Thanks Matt, I knew you had posted it somewhere.

Sion, I think MM runs standard valves with 6mm stems. That's what I have as well. I used the standard oil and water pump. My block had the anti drain back valve already installed in it. Not sure If I should have gone to a larger oil pump since I went down in size on the Lifters to 33mm.

Rohan,
Valves were 6mm stems with standard 33mm/int and 30.5mm/exh. The flow characteristics are still intact with stock valving. This is just my experience with E30M3 stuff. My M3 still has stock valves as well and making over 300HP.

Inlet is Dbilas 45mm ITB's with their plenum. AFM is removed but STOCK airbox is used. bmwman91 is correct that the stock airbox flows plenty! I had tested some supercar airbox with a fancy intake horn that was lying around at the dyno shop to see if there was an air restriction while tuning. That was a big NO. LOL. There was more than enough with the original stock box and paper filter.

Now the exhaust is an interesting one. I'm running a larger custom header 44.45mm. I can't remember what the stock header is. I then had a transition piece made with the O2 sensor which mates up to dual 1.75" (45mm) pipes with dual cats which then mates up to a dual pipe SuperSprint muffler. The exhaust is quiet but when you step on it, it has a nice tone along with the ITB's. The exhaust after the O2 sensor is all E30M3!!

Cheers,
~Ralph

Warsteiner · « **Reply #88 on:** August 03, 2015, 07:55:14 AM »

Norm, I may just have to sell you my motor then

Cheers,
~Ralph

sh123 · « **Reply #89 on:** August 03, 2015, 10:06:34 AM »

Have you had any porting done on the head. Im surprised by the power seeing as you have standard size valves. Im looking at standard inlet due to regulations.

Ive nevered of the oil drain back valve. How can i check if i have one? Ma 4 block

Cheers
Sion

Author Topic: Warsteiner, Wazzu70 and bmwman91 convince Norm he can build a smoking M42 (Read 26288 times)

Warsteiner

Re: Warsteiner, Wazzu70 and bmwman91 convince Norm he can build a smoking M42

normboudreault

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romkasponka

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wazzu70

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wazzu70

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Warsteiner

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sh123

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Warsteiner

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MLM

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sh123

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Darky

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normboudreault

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Warsteiner

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Warsteiner

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sh123

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