Author Topic: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?  (Read 6038 times)

Beeker1972

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Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« on: January 25, 2014, 12:01:42 AM »
About 3 weeks ago I bought a 1991 318i for 1200 bucks here in Mesa, AZ, USA.  It looks like it had been repainted, and reupholstered it looks good.  It's completely stock down to the 14inch wheel covers, on steel wheels.  It's a manual 5 speed, it's pretty spartan no cruze, an aftermarket radio, good heat, and A/C.  It says around 143,xxx miles on the non working odometer, but it have more, but it looks like previous owners took care of really well.  I had it on my dad's car lift changed engine, trans, and diff fluids they all looked good.  Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?  When I burn the current set of 14inch tires I will try to find a set of 5 E30 325ix 15 inch basket-weaves BBS wheels.  When it needs shocks, and struts I will be putting Billy's HDs on it.

romkasponka

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2014, 05:08:53 AM »
Make sleeper ;)
Put a turbo in it, E46 steering rack which is 30% faster and makes big change in car control and wider wheels than stock, at least R15j8.
E30 318is M42
E36 318is M44

Beeker1972

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2014, 11:39:06 AM »
Make sleeper ;)
Put a turbo in it, E46 steering rack which is 30% faster and makes big change in car control and wider wheels than stock, at least R15j8.

I think a super charger would be more fun than a turbo, but modern turbos do have little to no lag.  I wonder what Metric Mechanic does to get their tuned M42/44 crate engine to run up to 9k, and get them up to 2 to 2.1 liters.  I think with a little planning and some research someone can achieve the same result with off the shelf OE parts.  Then finding a 9k tack that looks OE to put into the cluster.

E46 racks have quicker ratios than M44 Z3s, or M44 Z3s only fit E36?

DesktopDave

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2014, 12:08:18 PM »
Same car as mine, the bargain basement baby Bimmer! 8) Welcome to the 'club!

The sedan is a great car, even better than the coupe IMHO. I use it to tote my family around, two more doors are oh-so-helpful in my situation. Given that my A/C is defunct, those rear windows substantially assist with ventilation. The sedan's resale value is pretty low too, so you don't have to worry about selling it off if you change your mind. Otherwise the two cars are pretty much identical. An iS shouldn't get modded - but the sedan is a whole different creature. Your options are definitely open. I've been upgrading mine for maximum fuel mileage. Is that a sleeper?  ??? I'm averaging nearly 30MPG with a few mods.

IIRC, unless you want to run spacers, the iX wheels will need spacers and longer log bolts or a stud upgrade. They also tend to be expensive - not sure why. Too rare from iX off-road hijinks?  ;D  I use an online calculator to check my math. IIRC, stock 14x5.5" steelies are a 35mm offset; 15x7" iX rims are 41. That gives the iX rims 25mm less backspace, about an inch. That's a bit tight for the strut, but a 25mm spacer could help out. You'd have a lot more rim under the fender too, it'd probably look great. I'd grab the iX cladding too, always liked the way that looked on the boxy little E30 sedan.That iX is totally different from every other E30s in many ways - AWD system, aluminum front subframe, shorter struts, odd cap bearings, etc. Given the number of cars that run the 4x100 hub pattern with a 68mm hub, you should be able to find a really decent & cheap aftermarket rim with a perfect offset for about the same money. Plus, you know they'll be round!

I run stock 14x6" bottlecaps on my E30 (et35?), though the 14x6.5" basketweaves were a nice upgrade. Keep in mind that bigger circumference rims will also lower your effective diff ratio - and the car will be even slower! You could use low-profile tires, but then that famous BMW ride quality takes a beating.

Another (admittedly expensive, but good) solution is a 5-lug upgrade. That'd open you up to a lot of different wheels, and some nice brake upgrades. If you luck out, you'd find an E30 M3 setup. If not, use offset E30 M3 bushings with late E36 control arms/knuckles/brakes/E30 ball joints, GC coil-overs with shorter Bilstein struts (the iX or VW Corrado Billy Sport strut is a good choice). On the rear, grab a six-cyl Z3 rear end. Seems like a straightforward swap. After you've done all that work, you'd need larger rims with less offset, like 20mm or so. The E34 and E38 ran a lot of good looking low-offset rims, and they're pretty cheap.

Euro 15x7.5" BBS basketweaves or Alpina rims do show up from time to time, but they're spendy. I have a set of cheap ASA 17" rims on my 745i, they're surprisingly high quality.
'08 Karmesinrot 128i 6MT
'86 Zinnoberrot 635CSi (M30B32/G265/3.46 torsen LSD)

Sold: '97 Montrealblau 318iS, '91 Brilliantrot 318i, '91 Brilliantrot 318iS

Beeker1972

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2014, 10:13:00 PM »
A sleeper is car that looks stock, but really really fast.  I want to stick with 4x100, because there's a ton of wheel options out there.  If I don't go OE I'm thinking set of 5 Konig Rewind Graphites in 15x7.  I can get them at my local Discount Tire for about a 100 bucks a piece.  (http://www.konigwheels.com/Konig-Home/Konig-Passenger-Wheels/REWIND-GRAPHITE) Over the next year I will try to go to the local salvage yards to find parts to beef up the drive-line so it will handle a modded S/C 2.x liter M42.  The only thing I wondering is to go full, some, or none urethane bushing replacement being it's my daily.  I heard Powerflex are the best for urethane bushings (http://powerflexusa.com/)

DesktopDave

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2014, 10:33:32 AM »
The powertrain is pretty robust, with the exception of the diff and the tranny mounts. To solve the diff problem, I swapped in a medium case from a 325iS. I have my car set up for max mileage and highway use, the taller rear end really helps out. It's not for everyone though... Considering your FI plans, a 3.64 might work well for you. The torsen type LSD from newer 6-cyl Z3 (3.64?) might be a really good choice. I'd also recommend the solid bushing rear diff mount - far more solid than the stock perforated type.

I'd definitely be rebuilding the rear subframe if you're planning on more power. I've never tried out polyurethane, only complaint I've heard is a bit less noise suppression.

Those Konig's look nice; remind me a bit of the Panasport "mags" I grew up with. Do they offer hub-centric inserts? They aren't 100% necessary if the rims are straight, but I find they're easier to work with if they match the BMW hub.
'08 Karmesinrot 128i 6MT
'86 Zinnoberrot 635CSi (M30B32/G265/3.46 torsen LSD)

Sold: '97 Montrealblau 318iS, '91 Brilliantrot 318i, '91 Brilliantrot 318iS

Beeker1972

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #6 on: January 26, 2014, 10:18:43 PM »
My brother had a M42B18 out of an E30 laying around at his house.  My dad and I went and picked it up I will be taking it apart for the next few weeks to learn on.  I just found out the manual transmission is an overdrive in the E30 318i/is so I don't think there would be any benefit in switching to a ZF GS6-37BZ other than the "WOW" factor of an E30 with a six speed.  I think I will be putting a set of 15x7 inch wheels with P185/60R-15 tires on the car after i burn the current set of tires.  I think those Konigs would look good on the car.


The powertrain is pretty robust, with the exception of the diff and the tranny mounts. To solve the diff problem, I swapped in a medium case from a 325iS. I have my car set up for max mileage and highway use, the taller rear end really helps out. It's not for everyone though... Considering your FI plans, a 3.64 might work well for you. The torsen type LSD from newer 6-cyl Z3 (3.64?) might be a really good choice. I'd also recommend the solid bushing rear diff mount - far more solid than the stock perforated type.

I'd definitely be rebuilding the rear subframe if you're planning on more power. I've never tried out polyurethane, only complaint I've heard is a bit less noise suppression.

Those Konig's look nice; remind me a bit of the Panasport "mags" I grew up with. Do they offer hub-centric inserts? They aren't 100% necessary if the rims are straight, but I find they're easier to work with if they match the BMW hub.

timothymcn

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #7 on: January 27, 2014, 11:53:18 PM »
185 might be a bit small. Just so you know, the manual lists 195 65 for 14x6.5 and 205 55 for 15x7.

Beeker1972

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2014, 09:03:26 PM »
running 185/70-14 at the moment

romkasponka

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2014, 03:28:15 AM »
225/45R15 J8 or J9 ;)
E30 318is M42
E36 318is M44

Beeker1972

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2014, 08:14:25 PM »
Fat tires are nice but at the moment it's my daily ... my old car was a 1987 535is 5speed with 3.73 LSD.  I had to fill the 2 times a week.  With the new to me car I fill up once a week.

DesktopDave

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2014, 09:25:16 PM »
Those E28s are a blast, surprisingly good handing even with the rather undersized stock wheels. The M30 is an absolute gem with a 5-speed...love that motor!

My old 633CSi had virtually the same motor (and about 300 pounds more metal), but the early E12 suspension was very old fashioned. The later E24/2 got the E28 suspension (and lost a few pounds too), made for a definite improvement.
'08 Karmesinrot 128i 6MT
'86 Zinnoberrot 635CSi (M30B32/G265/3.46 torsen LSD)

Sold: '97 Montrealblau 318iS, '91 Brilliantrot 318i, '91 Brilliantrot 318iS

Beeker1972

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2014, 09:06:00 PM »
You have a 745i with a 5 speed right?  M102 or M106 in that beast of a car?

Those E28s are a blast, surprisingly good handing even with the rather undersized stock wheels. The M30 is an absolute gem with a 5-speed...love that motor!

My old 633CSi had virtually the same motor (and about 300 pounds more metal), but the early E12 suspension was very old fashioned. The later E24/2 got the E28 suspension (and lost a few pounds too), made for a definite improvement.

DesktopDave

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2014, 10:14:59 PM »
You have a 745i with a 5 speed right?  M102 or M106 in that beast of a car?

It's an M106 that's been heavily upgraded, with a Getrag 260/5 IIRC. The original turbo was upgraded, chipped DME, RRFPR, bigger injectors, WG, WBO2. PO's dyno sheet had it putting down about 300HP & 250 lb/ft at the rear wheels. I'd love to have this motor running in a Euro E24.

The car pulls like a freight train. It's a little scary, to tell you the honest truth...an E23 shouldn't go that fast. The car runs well, but it still needs a lot of work. E23 pieces are fairly rare - but the special M106 bits are extremely scarce. I just finished repairing the odd-ball Behr vacuum servo HVAC system with some Mercedes parts, LOL.
'08 Karmesinrot 128i 6MT
'86 Zinnoberrot 635CSi (M30B32/G265/3.46 torsen LSD)

Sold: '97 Montrealblau 318iS, '91 Brilliantrot 318i, '91 Brilliantrot 318iS

Beeker1972

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Re: Keep it stock, mod, or sleeper?
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2014, 10:05:12 PM »
E23s are such sleeper cars ... So are E28s, but you can always look for a U.S. spec e24 and put euro bumpers/signals on it.  I was thinking of doing a South African spec E30 333i from an euro or 89/90/91 E30, or I saw Garagistic's M6x kit for E30 that could be a fun swap.  At the moment I don't have the time or money to do it.  If I was going to keep my E28 I would make it a 545is ...



You have a 745i with a 5 speed right?  M102 or M106 in that beast of a car?

It's an M106 that's been heavily upgraded, with a Getrag 260/5 IIRC. The original turbo was upgraded, chipped DME, RRFPR, bigger injectors, WG, WBO2. PO's dyno sheet had it putting down about 300HP & 250 lb/ft at the rear wheels. I'd love to have this motor running in a Euro E24.

The car pulls like a freight train. It's a little scary, to tell you the honest truth...an E23 shouldn't go that fast. The car runs well, but it still needs a lot of work. E23 pieces are fairly rare - but the special M106 bits are extremely scarce. I just finished repairing the odd-ball Behr vacuum servo HVAC system with some Mercedes parts, LOL.