Author Topic: Trying to Install E36 Fog lights..Need Power Source.. (Read 35655 times)

Wiker Man · « **on:** November 26, 2012, 01:11:01 AM »

My 1993 318is didn't come with factory installed fog lights so I am trying to do an aftermarket install, But I am having a hard time trying to figure out an proper source to power them.

I made my own "Kit" if you could call it that, I have a set of OEM Foglight's & Bulbs Mounted on my Bumper, 40A Relays, Some Automotive Fuses, Crimps and Wiring (regular Speaker cable). I can also do good Solder and heat shrink so no issues with making joints. I will probably use the crimps near the bumper, and inside the fuse box.

Basically I will be following this diagram

But I will probably bypass the fuse box diagram as I have found a fog light switch pre installed with some wiring that seems to be going under the dashboard, which leads me to believe that it probably also goes to the fuse box near the battery.

Now, If the Switch is already wired to the fuse box as I suspect it to be, then I will just have to trace the correct color code wire under the box and use that to open/close the relay. Then I am just left with connecting the power wire to the relay which can power the fogs (Total 110W I think so around 12V DC x 10A should do it. I have seen a solid Red Wire under the fuse box among a pile of wires which is unused(not connected to anything), there are also a quite a few more unused wires holstered inside black plastic connectors/casing...I was thinking to use that red wire, crimping it with a 10A fuse and then connecting to the relay powering the fogs.

Thanks for reading my lengthy paragraph, now I would like some of your input please

With much thanks...

David

ak96ss · « **Reply #1 on:** November 26, 2012, 04:34:55 AM »

FWIW, I wouldn't use speaker cable for anything but speakers, but that's me. I would also opt for quality crimp connections over solder, as soldering can make the connection brittle and subject to vibration issues over time.

Having said that, the E30 came with the harness and connections already in place, whether the car came out of the factory with fog lights or not. Adding fog lights is simply a matter of locating the existing connectors, typically wrapped up in the harness near the terminating points, and plugging everything in, as well as adding the appropriate fuses. No point in creating the additional expense of different wiring harnesses for cars with or without fog lights, it's cheaper for the company just to include everything on all cars.

Have you looked under the bumper and dash to see if the connectors are already there? Under the bumper will be connectors with two wires going into them, one yellow with a brown stripe and one brown. Under the dash will be a connector with two wires, yellow with a violet stripe and yellow with a green strip.

You'll also need the relay in K47 and a 15A fuse at F15.

Wiker Man · « **Reply #2 on:** November 26, 2012, 05:37:46 AM »

Thanks for your input buddy, it helps, Its actually a E36, But I also heard what you say was true for he e36 as well, unfortunately although I was really hoping to find the yellow wire with a brown stripe and a solid brown wire I could not find anything under the bumper or trace anything that lead to there from the fuse box. Yes I got some relays and fuses but there is no place on the fuse box to mount the fuses or additional relay, so I have to use the female crimps to connect the relay and just leave it there among the heap of wire inside the fuse box..

The only thing I found was the fog light switch and the yellow wire with violet strip and another with a green strip. Which leads me to believe my car is only half wired for fog lights, So the part I will probably have cover and to wire using the speaker wire would be from the fuse box to the bumper and then crimping it. Soldering is a option I kept for the interior of the car, the rest I will do via crimps and solid length of wires, they are copper speaker wire but look pretty thick, I would guess around 16 - 18 Gauge minimum..The other wires I have are from muliti socket plugs and they look quite thinner compared to the speaker wire..

So which solid wire do you think I could use for powering the fogs themselves? I am talking about when I use the switch that will power and "close" the relay making the circuit complete, but then I need a solid 12V power source that will power the fog lights once the circuit is closed, Do you suggest I use the Solid red wire I think I saw inside the fuse box and inline fuse it? or take power from somewhere else

keflaman · « **Reply #3 on:** November 26, 2012, 07:28:19 AM »

Speaking pragmatically, I installed fog light blanks in a few E36 cars because the owners tired of replacing fog lights damaged by (the wife:rolleyes:) hitting potholes, curbs, sidewalks, etc.

Like John said, the wiring harnesses are the same for all the cars and the wiring is there for fog lights. BMW sells a fog light kit and as you can see here, a wiring harness is not listed: http://bmwfans.info/parts/catalog/63179401689/

In a best case scenario, there will be a white, two-pin connector taped somewhere under LH/RH side of the bumper or along the wiring harness coming from the fuse box in the engine compartment. Because those connectors get very brittle and crumble easily after several years of service, it's also likely they have disintegrated and may very well have been cut off and taped back onto the wiring harness.

If your uncle is the original owner maybe he can shed some light on this. If not...look harder.

Edit: Here are the installation instructions for the kit courtesy of BavAuto. http://www.bavauto.com/Assets/inst_pages/ins023.pdf

Wiker Man · « **Reply #4 on:** November 26, 2012, 09:37:27 PM »

The wife eh? Point noted. I dont have a wife when I do get one I will see that she keeps her hands off the steering wheel

Okay Guys I have traced the wires and have some pics, need your feedback before I proceed.

1 The Switch itself has 2 legs, however the connector that connect to it has 3 Wires, The Bottom/Left one is Yellow w/ White Stripe Wire, Middle Wire is Wellow w/ Purple Stripe, And top one is Yellow w/ Wilver Stripe (I don't think has any function since the switch itself has only 2 legs)

2. I have traced both the Yellow w/ Purple Stripe Wire and the Yellow w/White Stripe wire.

The Yellow w/ White Stripe I was unable to trace back to the Fuse Box, It seems to be leading down the glovebox area down to the carpet, I did find one thin yellow wire w/ white spripe but it went into the fuse box and out one of its sides connecting to some component in the firewall.

However I was able to trace the Yellow/ Purple Stripe wire to the engine bay which seems to end connecting to a 10A Fuse that I suspect to be the Fog Lamp Fuse, and then the other end of the Fuse connects to a Yellow w/ Black Stripe wire.

iii. From the fuse where the Yellow w/Purple Stripe wire ends, I Traced the Yellow w/ Black Stripe Wire that starts from the fuse, and I came across these,

As you can see the Yellow w/Black Stripe was sitting inside a Plastic housing crimped, I removed(broke the housing and removed it

This was inside, It connects to another Yellow w/ Black Stripe wire that goes into a Green Relay's Center / 87a

My Uncle bought the car at an auction, The Car was an import from UK or Japan, not sure. But didnt come with the fog lights. Uncle is out of the country so dont think he can be much of a help any more. There doesn't seem to be any wires under the bumper, So I will have to wire it myself from the fuse box, not really looking to buy a BMW Kit since I already have everything I need, just need to sort out the problems inside the fuse box and I should be good to go.

How should I proceed? what are those Black Plastic things that house these crimped wires? am I supposed to remove the Crimped Yellow w/Black Stripe wire and connect it to a Relay? a bit confused since the other Yellow/Black stripe wire leads to a Relay :confused:.

Wiker Man · « **Reply #5 on:** November 28, 2012, 03:25:15 PM »

Bump

keflaman · « **Reply #6 on:** November 28, 2012, 08:51:18 PM »

My head hurts. So this is a RHD vehicle? Can you post the last seven digits of the VIN in order to verify what market it was built for?

Judging by the picture of a wiring harness I found, I'd say the plastic connector you butchered is where the power comes in for your fog lights. http://www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=XQv&sa=X&tbo=d&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&biw=1280&bih=606&tbm=isch&tbnid=ElscPfU7Q2-5MM:&imgrefurl=http://www.schmiedmann.dk/3er_serien/E36/Reservedele-elektroniske_dele_fx_rude-hejs-viskesyst-div/Elektroniske_dele/side4.htm&docid=VgsDTU8rmlqBNM&imgurl=http://static.schmiedmann.dk/ProductPictures/image_4308_big.jpg&w=600&h=289&ei=8Mu2ULrxKJSF0QGqh4GYAQ&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=4&vpy=323&dur=1&hovh=156&hovw=324&tx=178&ty=51&sig=116316221047867964780&page=1&tbnh=127&tbnw=264&start=0&ndsp=19&ved=1t:429,r:7,s:0,i:109

Wiker Man · « **Reply #7 on:** December 02, 2012, 12:02:36 AM »

keflaman, I think that picture will help me a lot. thanks.

Yes it s the RHD vehicle, Originally a UK or Jap import if I am not mistaken, mind telling me where the VIN number is? I cant for the life of me figure it out.

I noticed something, you see that Black female connector at the right side, on the top? I have that inside the fuse box, look at the background of this image..

I think Its time I tested it with a Multimeter with the switch on and see if thats the one that powers up with the fogs.. I will ticker around a bit more and let you know, I might also have a parasitic drain which I will try to figure out.

keflaman · « **Reply #8 on:** December 02, 2012, 07:42:27 AM »

The one best place to look for the VIN is on the leading edge of the windshield cowl panel. With the hood up you will see the number stamped in the sheet metal. Alternately, there should be a sticker in the driver's door jamb or look for a black sticker with white letters/numbers in places on the body panels.

I found the photo useful...it was an "ah-ha" moment the second I saw the connectors.

Wiker Man · « **Reply #9 on:** December 02, 2012, 10:20:38 PM »

keflaman, I got some good news and some bad news..

Good news is I first tested the car for parasitic drain, set the Multimeter at 10A and red probe at 10A DC and hooked it up in series between the battery negative post and cars negative terminal. There is a initial rise due to the alarm setting off but as soon as I turn the alarm off it reads 0.03 amps (so around 30 miliamps). So I guess thats normal no battery drains there. My Battery also seems to be in the 12.8V - 12.9V Range. Which means the battery is good too.

Okay now thats done let me get back to the Foglights.. I hooked up the Foglight switch and turned on the cars lights to the 3 rd position and then clicked the foglights switch and the foglights icon on the cluster lights up.

Thats the good news, Bad news is I went inside the engine bay while the foglight icon was lit, I hooked my multi meter inside the Black connector, but didnt show any voltage running through it :confused: I was really hoping that was the connector, I also checked the foglight push button switch's wires and there didn't seem to be any power running through them? I am going to try and re run some tests tomorrow.

I am a bit lost, give me some suggestions man, at this point I am thinking to perhaps rewire the whole thing, it shouldn't be too much work, but still I wonder if I missed some fuses though? I have a 10A Fuse is there any other fuses I should know of? Maybe I could check them too

Wiker Man · « **Reply #10 on:** December 02, 2012, 10:53:05 PM »

ps: I wonder if I am supposed to set up a separate fog light relay as shows in this picture? I don't have that green relay installed, not sure how I'm expected to wire it of if I need it at all. I also need to check fuse #22 as not just #15.

Wiker Man · « **Reply #11 on:** December 03, 2012, 04:00:46 AM »

Just a little update since I came across this other forum where this guy installed fog light sets on his e36. It gives an idea but I am having problems following what the guy is trying to say. Its decently documented but not so well written / hard to follow..

can somebody put this in laymans terms, its real hard to understand..

http://www.bmwforums.info/general-guides-how-tos/973-retro-fitting-front-fogs-e36-using-bmw-loom-pics.html

Here are some pics

PS: Keflaman I sent you a PM with some details, hope you get it..

keflaman · « **Reply #12 on:** December 03, 2012, 07:57:14 AM »

Quote from: Wiker Man;118139

Just a little update since I came across this other forum where this guy installed fog light sets on his e36. It gives an idea but I am having problems following what the guy is trying to say. Its decently documented but not so well written / hard to follow..

can somebody put this in laymans terms, its real hard to understand..
http://www.bmwforums.info/general-guides-how-tos/973-retro-fitting-front-fogs-e36-using-bmw-loom-pics.html

PS: Keflaman I sent you a PM with some details, hope you get it..

I got your PM this morning. Give me some time to digest it and I'll get back with you.

Wiker Man · « **Reply #13 on:** December 03, 2012, 10:23:58 PM »

man, this is so much more trouble than it is worth. I am so mad at BMW for screwing so many things by cheeping out on our cars. okay so I figured out a few things. That Black female connector with Grey/Yellow and grey / silver wire most likely is what powers the Foglight relay, The original bmw harness has a similar male connector that plugs in there and then to a relay.

The $200 - $500 BMW harness is nothing but a Bosh relay, a fuse and some connectors that's it. The Foglight wiring can be done under 10 bucks if the foglight switch is working...The real deal is getting the black foglight 12V switch to work. You know the one that seems to get power from the headlight relay.

When I push the foglight button the Green Foglight icon doesn't come on the dash. So something is messed un in the wiring somewhere. If I can get the foglight switch to work as in provide power then It will be a piece of cake to wire up the rest. thats all i need to get the fog light switch to work and provide power. I dont get any readings from the yellow/purple or other wires connecting to the switch when I power the car, lights etc...

Wiker Man · « **Reply #14 on:** December 04, 2012, 02:41:07 AM »

okay so I have come up with a schematic of basically how this works...

Now this thing is nothing but a a relay and some connectors. And should be do able for less then $10. I will get to that later but first for us to understand how this would wire up lets remind ourselves how a relay works and the difference between a BOSH/BMW Relay made for our cars and a regular relay.

As you can see the relays on our cars have a sightly different terminal locations compared to regular relays. They both function the same way, the tab's and leg/terminal output on the BMW relays simply makes it 'idoit proof'.

Now lets see how the Harness works

� Term 30 Pin 6 = Main power feed
� Term 85 Pin 4 = Earth
� Term 86 Pin 8 = Feed from switch
� Term 87 Pin 2 = Feed from relay to warning light in cluster
� Term 87 Pin 5 = Feed from relay to front lights via fuse 15

And Whats What on the Harness BMW provides..

So if my schematics are close to being accurate, Then I think the think That needs to be done is getting the Foglight switch inside the dash to work and Provide the 12V to the Black Connector, If that can be achived then the rest is just plug and play... Bad news is my Switch is not receiving or delivering any power to either its ow connectors or the black connector inside the fuse box. But the Foglight dash icon comes up when I put the Highbeam on...:confused: What am I missing...why is there no power.. Fuse 15 is connected and Purple/Yellow wire also connected...:confused: