The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story

Author Topic: The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story  (Read 9662 times)

bmwman91

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I just got back from a great weekend of climbing in Joshua Tree. It is an annual trip, and the driving is usually done by someone else with a newer car that gets better mileage. Well, all of my Bay Area buddies bailed on the trip, so I drove the E30 down there & met some of my friends from San Diego. Overall, it was ~1100 miles between friday & yesterday. I averaged 60mph (maintained 70-75mph on the highway) and got 29mpg...pretty darn good! For anyone that has ever driven CA247 to Barstow, and CA58 to Bakersfield/I5, you know my deep sense of relief for making it out of the Mojave desert. It is beautiful country, but I would never want to break down there (desert plains at 3000-4000ft altitude).

Anyway, being that I have had a 318iS for ~12 years, I have developed sort of a 6th sense for the thing. Anyone that has driven a car that long can probably pick out the slightest abnormal noise or vibration. I rebuilt my timing case last May when my idler sprocket came apart, and since then I have been getting this odd rattling/knocking sound with a fully warmed-up engine, between 3100 & 3400RPM. I have had the timing case covers off a couple of times since then, trying to figure the noise's source out & replacing suspect parts, but to no avail. So, knowing that something was up with the timing assembly, let's just say that I was nervous for the entire 1100 mile drive!

On I5, maybe 15 miles south of the Kettleman City exit, I noticed what seemed like a new noise, but I told myself to ignore it as road noise. I sort of knew that it wasn't, but I was irritated with the car, and what else was I going to do other than keep driving home? I pull off at the Shell station, planning to get gas & a burger before the last ~3 hours of the drive. As I pull in to the station, I hear the wonderful rattling, diesel-like sound that is characteristic of an M42 with a loose timing chain. Mmmmm, valves kissing pistons and a chain slapping stuff. So, I am instantly pissed. This is 164 miles from home. I have a Gold AAA towing membership, and I COULD get a tow all the way, although that would likely take me 5-6 hours instead of 2-3.

I let my fiancee know that I may be a little late and I am deciding whether or not to try to drive the car. I can tell that she is rolling her eyes at the E30; she doesn't share my love for the little red money pit that is always causing grief. I also call my parents, that live about 20 miles from my place, to let them know that my car will be going there where I will either fix it, or have it towed to a shop. I have been in the timing case 3 times now, in the last 10 months. At this point, I am ready to just pay someone else to deal with it. I HAVE to fix it, either to keep driving it, or to sell it.

So, I decide to see how far the car will get me. At this point, I don't even care that it is broken. Worst case, I get a Metric Mechanic motor if the timing assembly self-destructs on the way home. I gas it up, and start it. GOD I hate that noise! Well, I find that once I rev it over 2500RPM, the noise goes away. Presumably, the oil pressure builds up enough to push the tensioner rail hard enough to take out the slack from [whatever] broke. There is still some abnormal vibration, but it is really slight. All but the last 2 of the 164 miles are highway, and it is late enough that there isn't commute traffic in San Jose, meaning that I can keep the RPMs consistent at around 3000RPM. So, I have a nervous 2.5 hour drive with my fingers crossed. I pull onto my parents' street, kill the engine & coast to a stop in front of their curb. PHEW!

----------------------------------------

OK, so what broke? That 3300RPM rattling noise from the last year that I had mentioned had disappeared, and of course was replaced with the sound of a loose timing chain. So, whatever was making the mystery noise finally gave up the ghost. On the bright side, I should be able to find the broken part now, since whatever it is, is now dead haha. I checked the obvious stuff; the oil level was A-OK, and the tensioner piston was still good. My bet had been on the idler sprocket, that I had replaced last May, blowing up, but I don't think that is the case.

After my last rebuild, I swear that the tensioner piston was easier to install. It had the right stiffness, but the amount of compression I needed to put into it to install it seemed like less than I remembered. If you have replaced it you know what I mean...you insert it, and then you need to compress the spring maybe 1" in order to thread the cap. Well, after the last rebuild I only needed to compress it maybe 0.5" to get the threads engaged. I told myself that I was being paranoid & tried to forget about it.

NOW, after [whatever] broke, the tensioner needs about 1" of compression, and something MOVES when I push it in. I am suspecting that the tensioner rail that the piston pushes on has broken, probably at its pivot point. Either the rail itself has gone south, or the pivot pin in the timing case has broken. When I opened the oil cap, I could see small flecks of aluminum in the oil (and on the dipstick). The chain was probably chewing off metal from around the thermostat housing casting in the head. I also don't like that, but at least the little bits will all eventually get caught in the filter. The motor has 220108 miles now, and that's a decent amount for an original motor...perhaps it is time to retire it.

I last replaced all of the timing case components (guides, rails, chain, sprockets) in 2006, about 75000 miles ago. Given that I have driven the car pretty hard in that time, it is conceivable that the timing parts have worn out. Sheesh, time flies! I still think of the engine as having freshly replaced parts, but it really has been a long time! Anyway, now that I have had a good night's sleep, I am trying to decide on what to do. I really am sick of working on this damn car, and I want a solid, reliable car to do road trips with. In saying that, I sort of know that a 22 year old German car just isn't quite the right match haha. But still, I have driven an E30 for 12 years, and there just isn't a single newer car I can think of (or in my price range) that is an actual DRIVER'S car. So here are the options I am considering:

- Tow the car to a German auto specialist to have them deal with [whatever] broke. It will be a little costly, but I just don't know if I can stand to lose another weekend working on the thing.
- Suck it up & rip it apart myself. Cheaper, but I lose a weekend.
- Buy a Metric Mechanic Sport M42. Much more costly, but at least I don't have to worry about engine problems again for a very long time. I am not sure if I would do the swap or just pay a shop to do it for me, for the same reason as above. I would probably shell out for a MM transmission and differential while I was at it, just to make sure that the whole drive train is SOLID.
- Have a shop repair the engine, sell the car & get something new(er). The new Ford Focus gets better mileage, has the 4 doors that I sort of want, and a warranty. It lacks the soul of the E30, but I am really sick of WORRYING every time I take my car anywhere. This makes the least economic sense of course, but it would get me peace of mind, which is hard to put a price tag on.

Something funky is also up with the clutch (I can feel / hear a popping as I release the clutch), so I would have that taken care of as well. What are you guys' thoughts? I love this car, but I think it is sort of an irrational response based on the fact that I have dumped thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours into this thing. I KNOW that a newer car is the answer to my road-tripping needs, but I keep thinking that I can make my 22 year old German car reliable. Is this textbook insanity? Does my car have me held captive, and I have developed Stockholm syndrome?
« Last Edit: April 04, 2012, 12:14:42 PM by bmwman91 »

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willworkfore30s

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2012, 12:16:50 PM »
24v Swap

In all seriousness though, I replaced my m42 with a running one for $70.  ($300 150k motor - $230 that I got out of the messed up motor).

To me, a weekend and a little bit of cash is worth it compared to either the cost of shop repair or a metric mechanic engine.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2012, 12:19:00 PM by willworkfore30s »

colin86325

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2012, 12:18:58 PM »
MM M42!  :)

Sorry to hear about your problems, I know it can be very frustrating.  As for hte clutch you might want to check the pedal box area to make sure the linkage is intact.  Sometimes the metal can be fatigued.  There is also a clutch reurn spring that can come loose.

Keep us updated bud!

bmwman91

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2012, 12:27:11 PM »
Yeah, I know that the pedal linkage is having issues. It rattles audibly at ~3500RPM, and there is a little slop in it. I will have to take a look. What part fatigues & breaks? Where is the return spring?

Another funny thing...about 10 miles from home yesterday, one of the horn buttons on the steering wheel started sticking on! I swear, it was the car giving me its death cry or something. My god, WHY DO I HAVE THIS CAR? lol

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Gerta318is

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2012, 12:56:07 PM »
bmwman - I feel your pain.  I think I would rather lose a weekend rebuilding an engine and replacing what is probably a pedal spring than shelling out for a new (or even new to me car).  I've just finished a rebuild similar to yours and mine is leaking fresh oil.  IMO the option of a engine swap (1500 -3000 bucks) for 24V isn't what you want to do.  

Personally if you have the dough (6000 bucks) for a MM Sport engine and then 2000 k for tranny/diff/flywheel - I'd do that.  I spoke to Jim on Monday because I am considering doing it.  Another option he gave was to find a M44 bottom and then do the head - 2500 or so for a MM head.  This is the route I am pretty sure that I am going.  All in slightly more than a 24v swap - perfect for what I am looking for.  I may even cheap out and simply buy some component of the head from MM and have the new head done locally.  Jim was great - he said he'd give me the phone support for the build because he wants every customer to have success.  

let me know if you want to chat on the phone - PM me and I can send you my number.

Gerta

keflaman

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2012, 12:57:36 PM »
If you go with MM how long would it take to see your money returned in a cost-per-mile sense VS buying a newer car? One other aspect regarding your options I think you need to consider is your future marital status. Once the fiancée becomes your wife dumping "thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours" into a little red money pit will become a very sore issue.

OTOH, I think I'd opt to go into the engine yourself, diagnose it, fix it and rent a car for long trips.

bmwman91

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2012, 01:28:47 PM »
Yeah, I want to sit on this for a couple of days. I know that I am still sort of pissed, and no good can come from making a decision while feeling that way. I have no real dependence on the car since my commute is a 5 minute bike ride, and I haven't driven to work in like 5 months.

I know which options make sense financially, and none of them include MM motors or new cars. I have been saving for a house for 6 years now, so I can just pay cash for whatever it is that I decide to do since Real Estate in the Bay Area is still super inflated and I am not interested in buying any time soon.

Fixing the motor & renting something for road trips is not a bad option, actually. I need to work up some amortization schedules & stuff in MS Excel & see just how things would play out. In the long run, keeping the E30 & renting something for long drives is probably the best balance of economics & peace-of-mind.

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vonkamp

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2012, 07:09:20 PM »
You have quite a dilemma there... Sounds like it may be time for a fresh motor. It's no fun driving a car that makes you nervous. Would buying a MM motor give you peace of mind? If so, it may very well be worth the extra $$

I have rented cars for road trips and that seems to be a good option for me. Plus it makes me realize how much I like my cabrio after driving an Aveo...
92 318i Cabrio

bmwman91

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #8 on: April 04, 2012, 07:16:09 PM »
Well, a MM motor, tranny & diff would give me a lot of peace of mind. At the same time, I would be a little worried about all the injection/ignition electronics, the suspension & the chassis. Being totally honest...an E30 really is not a wonderful primary vehicle as of 2012. I can see it being a GREAT weekend car, but I think that they all have little ticking time-bombs going in them in all sorts of areas. They are awesome cars, and I would miss mine immensely if I ended up getting rid of it.

Whatever I do though, I need to get it running first!

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n2motorsports

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #9 on: April 04, 2012, 09:43:04 PM »
wanted to pull the trigger on the focus as well, but every time i drive a new car, it just doesn't fell right without all the rattling and road noise.  

next time my m42 breaks... (puts on flame suit) im gonna shove a s50 down it's throat.

bmwman91

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #10 on: April 04, 2012, 11:33:13 PM »
Anyone got a reputable BMW engine builder in the Bay Area? I would also be cool with dropping maybe a few $thousand on a proper, stock M42 rebuild; COMPLETE top & bottom end overhaul. I know that the clutch & tranny are on their way out & I might see about a MM tranny to go with it. The insanity is back & think I can resurrect the car again lol.

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colin86325

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #11 on: April 05, 2012, 08:33:05 AM »
A brand new factory engine is $3,728.21 shipped (after core charge).  :)

bmwman91

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2012, 11:18:50 AM »
Where can I order a new factory engine from?

I called up Bavarian Auto Exchange & they ask $5500 for a fully stock rebuilt one w/ a 5 year warranty. It is $6500 with their performance option ("20% power increase"). So, that sounds mostly like the same thing as Metric Mechanic's Sport engine.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2012, 11:29:17 AM by bmwman91 »

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wazzu70

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2012, 11:36:42 AM »
The dealer can order them. The PN is in RealOEM.

I have been in a similar situation before. You dont want to spend unnecessary money, but you don't have time to half ass things and have them break either. Also, I just got married and my car sees much less hobby time now :(. The advice to do something now before you are married because its much harder afterward is very true!

What I would do, have the M42 rebuilt. Much cheaper than a new car and it will last you a long time. A factory type rebuild if you dont get too fancy should be more managable.

I would look into a MM 1.8L based engine, basically stock rebuild with their little improvements. If you want some more go juice, cams really wake the engine up.

For the trans, I would just get a good used ZF from an e36. A much stronger trans and easy to come by. The ratios are different so you need to get a shorter rear gear ratio. Get one from a Z3 thats a torsen unit. Diffs rarely go bad in BMWs. In the race cars I work on, we mostly use junkyard diffs.

Seriously, this will upgrade your drivetrain to be more reliable and even improved for the cost. Its a really good bang for the buck IMO.

If you have any questions, post here or PM me. I recently rebuilt my M42 so I have some background. Im also realistic/budget minded :)
-Nick
91 E30 M42 with VEMS

bmwman91

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The Little Motor That Keeps Breaking Part 2 (3? 4? 5?) - Long Story
« Reply #14 on: April 05, 2012, 12:17:16 PM »
Awesome, thanks!

I think I might have to get a rebuilt motor...the shop that I was talking to said that they don't want to touch my broken motor. WTF? I thought shops were, you know, supposed to take money in exchange for doing work? Maybe it has to do with the fact that I drove it with a known bad timing chain & it is some sort of liability?

There is a local BMWCCA chapter coffee meet in 2 weekends that I am also thinking of going to. Maybe someone there knows of a local shop that does quality rebuilds. Honestly, I need to get this thing running in the near future. My employer has me traveling a lot right now, and that doesn't leave much weekend time for wrenching, so whatever happens, I am going to need to pay some extra cash to get things moving again.

I plugged the realOEM PN into Pelican Parts' search engine, and a remanufactured engine is $5000. I have to assume that the dealer is at least 30% more.

A engine recycler near here does have an M42 right now, for $1100. It is sold as-is with a 2 year warranty on parts. While that seems like it may be the cheapest & fastest option, I am a bit nervous about getting a motor with completely unknown timing case age. Hmmmmmm...

06/05/2011 - 212,354 miles
Visit HERE for a plethora of 318iS stuff and some other randomness.  Would you say I have a, plethora, of pinatas?