Author Topic: Cracked My Thermostat Housing...Should Have Known Better [PICS Added 6/25/11]  (Read 22043 times)

bmwman91

  • Administrator
  • Legendary
  • *****
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 33
  • Posts: 2798
    • View Profile
    • http://www.e30tuner.com/
So back when I was rebuilding the motor, I managed to lose one of the thermostat housing bolts. Being tired, I put 3 in and cranked them all the way down, with the gasket sealer + gasket. I later went to the hardware store, got a replacement & torqued that in. So there was the first mistake...should have waited & done all 4 a little at a time to get even seating. I didn't think I did anything wrong then though. This was a few weeks ago.

Anyway, I was looking around under there to see if everything was looking good, and I saw a little coolant leaked onto the housing. It seemed to be coming from the top driver's side bolt area. So, I got a 10mm socket out & tightened it a little. POP! Coolant came pissing out (the system was still warm, and under pressure from driving). Shit, I managed to grow a small existing crack into a nice big one. So I released the pressure by pulling the tank cap.

Once the pressure was out & it stopped pissing coolant, I set about "fixing" it. I took out the fan+shroud & moved the VR sensor out of the way. The area was cleaned with some MEK, and no additional coolant wept out onto my work area. Then, I mixed up some JB Weld & slathered it onto the area & tried my best to work it into the thin crack that was maybe 15mm long.

The car will sit until tomorrow afternoon, hopefully allowing the JBW to cure fully (the engine was warm, and the weather is too). Anyway, a new TStat housing is on its way now, along with the gasket & O-ring (which were just replaced, sadly). My question is "how long will the JBW fix last?" I need to get around a little this week, and I have a friend's wedding rehearsal on Thursday that is 60 miles away. I am hoping that I can get by with this for a week or so. I didn't sand the area or anything, but it was clean.

06/05/2011 - 212,354 miles
Visit HERE for a plethora of 318iS stuff and some other randomness.  Would you say I have a, plethora, of pinatas?

keflaman

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 35
  • Posts: 929
    • View Profile
I can't say how long it will last, but it would have been better to sand the area with a coarse grit, "V" the crack out and then apply the JB Weld.

bmwman91

  • Administrator
  • Legendary
  • *****
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 33
  • Posts: 2798
    • View Profile
    • http://www.e30tuner.com/
Hmm, yeah that sounds like it would have made for a better bond. I haven't worked with JBW much, but it seems reasonable that a coarse surface would give better results. Oh well, as long as it lasts me ~250 miles I am good. Heck, I might be able to bum a ride to the wedding thing with my friend.

06/05/2011 - 212,354 miles
Visit HERE for a plethora of 318iS stuff and some other randomness.  Would you say I have a, plethora, of pinatas?

monty23psk

  • Legendary
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 17
  • Posts: 1291
    • View Profile
Oh man, sucks on the bad luck. But you should be good to go for that mileage on JB weld. I have seen worse damage secured with JB weld before and it held up. All about the curing time.
Alex  88 m5 | 91 318is | 19 Subaru Ascent
BMW Tool Rentals & Fender Roller

bmwman91

  • Administrator
  • Legendary
  • *****
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 33
  • Posts: 2798
    • View Profile
    • http://www.e30tuner.com/
Yup. I should have snapped a picture last night. The crack is ~15mm long, sort of curving around the screw boss in the housing. The width is well under 1mm, probably like 0.5mm at the middle. I mixed up the JBW & it was pretty runny, so I slapped it on there & I think that at least SOME had to get down into the crack. I just made sire to get it 5mm out on each side around the perimeter. Cleaning with MEK seemed to get all the crap off, and it was relatively clean to begin with.

The JBW will have been sitting for 20-24 hours when I go get the car later today. With the warm weather, that should be ample time for full curing.

I was at my parents' house (Father's Day). He has a TIG welder, but I am really bad with Aluminum. I probably could have done that, but I would have had to drain the coolant, and if I were to go to the trouble of draining/filling/bleeding, I may as well just wait for the new housing.

06/05/2011 - 212,354 miles
Visit HERE for a plethora of 318iS stuff and some other randomness.  Would you say I have a, plethora, of pinatas?

monty23psk

  • Legendary
  • ******
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 17
  • Posts: 1291
    • View Profile
I was thinking how bad it got so that the bleeding was necessary. If the new one is on the way, then waiting is not a bad idea to prevent draining/filling/bleeding it twice.
Alex  88 m5 | 91 318is | 19 Subaru Ascent
BMW Tool Rentals & Fender Roller

bmwman91

  • Administrator
  • Legendary
  • *****
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 33
  • Posts: 2798
    • View Profile
    • http://www.e30tuner.com/
I will not be bleeding it at all until I replace the housing. No air got in as far as I can tell. If a little did, it should just work itself out since the system was designed to handle small bubbles.

06/05/2011 - 212,354 miles
Visit HERE for a plethora of 318iS stuff and some other randomness.  Would you say I have a, plethora, of pinatas?

jrobie79

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 1
  • Posts: 350
    • View Profile
i have had jb weld with some RTV on top of that for the past year or so in my t-stat housing (did the same thing, bout 2 inch crack) no leaks or anything

bmwman91

  • Administrator
  • Legendary
  • *****
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 33
  • Posts: 2798
    • View Profile
    • http://www.e30tuner.com/
Well, it looks like the JB is holding. No coolant is coming out of the crack.

BUT, it is leaking from somewhere on the housing! There's a slow leak that pisses coolant all over. It is probably a gap between the head & housing since the screw boss cracked & can't pull the housing flat against the head. So, now I open the expansion tank cap every time I park to let the pressure out so it doesn't sit there leaking coolant while parked.

I'll be swapping housings Saturday anyway, so whatever.

06/05/2011 - 212,354 miles
Visit HERE for a plethora of 318iS stuff and some other randomness.  Would you say I have a, plethora, of pinatas?

keflaman

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 35
  • Posts: 929
    • View Profile
Well, you tried and real-world experience counts for something. I think I'll throw a kit of JBW in the trunk with the duct tape, worm clamps, zip ties, tire plug kit......

92BMW318is

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 0
  • Posts: 244
    • View Profile
Link "http://www.mre-books.com/sa69/sa69_3.html"



   "Some block cracking can be repaired via welding or JB Weld. JB Weld is a two-part catalyzed
product that works well with cracked cast iron. Properly mixed and cured, it will last the life of any
engine block. For JB Weld to work effectively, you need a clean surface and a crack that has been
carefully stop drilled at each end. Just a small 1/16-inch stop drill hole at each end slows and stops
cracking. Then weld or JB Weld the crack. We suggest against the use of JB Weld on the cylinder
walls and decks where stresses can be extreme. Your machine shop will know best on what call to
make on repair. Some blocks are cracked beyond repair."

bmwman91

  • Administrator
  • Legendary
  • *****
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 33
  • Posts: 2798
    • View Profile
    • http://www.e30tuner.com/
Well, she's all back together & I think I am done battling the cooling system. A new thermostat housing, gasket, O-ring & proper gasket sealing have it working nicely. I know I did a better job this time, because 99% of the air bled out in the first 15 seconds after starting the car! It made a nasty shrieking noise as the pump pushed out all the air through the bleed screw, and then it quieted down. If you can avoid clogging that groove in the thermostat housing, it will let all the trapped air pass right through, without having to wait for the motor to heat up & open the thermostat. I bled the hell out of it anyway, even after it warmed up, but only a number tiny bubbles made it out. The M42 is actually very easy to bleed, as long as you don't clog the bleed groove!


Upon removing the housing, I noticed a few things. For one, the little bleed bypass groove was caked with the gasket sealer. I did my best to brush it on very lightly around there, but it still managed to gunk up. It doesn't help that the rubber O-ring on the thermostat squishes into this groove and probably closes it off 75%. That makes this a prime catch-point for RTV and other sealants.

The main reason I had a leak was because the gasket managed to shift a little and split open. It was probably due to a loss of clamping force from the busted bolt tab, and me cutting it over the bleed groove to try to reduce clogging. For some reason, the gasket sealer was totally gone on one side of the gasket! It wasn't on the head either!


Here is the crack, from the inside. It is bigger than I thought. It grew a little on the outside, and was weeping coolant slowly, even after the JB weld.


Speaking of JB weld...it did its job well. If you clean your work area thoroughly with some sort of solvent and give it 24 hours to cure (on room-temp engine parts, NOT hot expanded ones), it seems to be pretty bomb-proof. The instructions recommend drilling 1.5mm holes at the end of cracks to stop them from growing. That's good advice, if you have the part off the car so drilling chips don't go in the motor! I also recommend hitting the work area with a steel or brass bristle brush to get any hard crap off, and roughen it up for the JBW.


You can see how the O-ring squishes into the bleed groove. It fills it up most of the way, and will clog if you have stray gasket sealer.


So, here was the new housing and gasket. This time, I used a spray version of the non-curing sealer since I knew I would get it on too heavy with the liquid/brush version. I also left the gasket intact over the bleed groove since removing that seemed to cause more harm than good.


Finally, here's the stuff I have used. The can on the left was used on the old gasket, and mysteriously disappeared from one side. It is good stuff, and none of my oil-related gaskets are leaking. It just didn't seem to do the trick on my thermostat housing.

The stuff on the right is what I sprayed on to the new gasket. I sprayed both sides with 3 light coats & let it dry for 3-4 minutes. Then I put it onto the housing, and then I put that onto the motor. I carefully installed the housing this time. I put all 4 bolts in, and hand-tightened each from opposing-corners like you would with lug-nuts. Then I gave each one a 1/4 turn, in the same fashion, until they were all fully torqued.



So, with the exception of a cracked vacuum hose (it is brand new, but somehow a junk Chinese brand is now an "OE" supplier...CRP Industries, beware) and a nasty rattling noise at 3000RPM, I am good. I think the rattle is the stripped bolt that holds the top of the driver's side timing chain guide to the head. That'll be next weekend's project I guess. If it isn't that, I have NO idea, because I checked just about everything else outside the motor! The noise has been present since the day I rebuilt it a few weeks ago.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2011, 02:12:34 AM by bmwman91 »

06/05/2011 - 212,354 miles
Visit HERE for a plethora of 318iS stuff and some other randomness.  Would you say I have a, plethora, of pinatas?

jdirty

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 0
  • Posts: 116
    • View Profile
i'm afraid this might be my problem too... hissing and steam from housing. -_-

Stringer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 0
  • Posts: 10
    • View Profile
bringing this thread back from the dead... i have this same issue and am attempting to fix it with JB weld. However, it seems like the O ring supplied with the thermostat seems to be too thick... like it's causing a lot of pressure behind the housing when installed and caused the crack in the first place. Is that O ring even necessary? It seems weird how it basically clogs the bleed bypass and the housing sits much more evenly (perfectly in fact) without it.

bmwman91

  • Administrator
  • Legendary
  • *****
  • Thank You
  • -Receive: 33
  • Posts: 2798
    • View Profile
    • http://www.e30tuner.com/
I think that the O-ring is necessary. It keeps the thermostat in place, and it would probably flop about without it. I too was worried that the O-ring was clogging the bypass, but as long as you don't slather a ton of gasket sealer in there, it should still function. Overall, I think that the O-ring should remain.

As long as you are patient in securing the housing, you are good. lightly hand-tighten all 4 bolts, and then go criss-cross tightening them each a little at a time to apply even pressure. if you install them one at a time at max torque all in one shot, you'll crush the gasket on one side and then destroy it when you go to secure the other side. That was my mistake which caused the crack!

06/05/2011 - 212,354 miles
Visit HERE for a plethora of 318iS stuff and some other randomness.  Would you say I have a, plethora, of pinatas?