small case vs medium case diffs

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B318M42W

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small case vs medium case diffs
« on: March 16, 2010, 10:04:37 PM »
Hi! My good ol' 4.10 small case is getting pretty tired and i want to swap in a 3.73 medium case in. I was wondering how can i tell a small case vs a medium case? what to look for in a used diff? (open or LSD, doesn't really matter) and what are the things that i should do to it before i put it in (change oil for sure).

Thanks!
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tjts1

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small case vs medium case diffs
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2010, 10:21:57 PM »
Change the oil and maybe reseal the rear cover before installing it. Small case will have 6 bolts on the back cover, medium case has 8. Depending on the year it came out of, the speedometer plug might be different. Have your old speedo sensor handy.

Small case left, medium right.
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B318M42W

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« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2010, 10:36:40 PM »
great! thanks!!
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small case vs medium case diffs
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2010, 06:22:31 AM »
My small case looked just like that before I replaced it with a medium 3.73.  Nice difference, highly recommended.

Definitely swap the sensor over too, and I'd cut a bit of the harness off the donor if possible.  Older ones use the same sensor but the plug is different.  I stripped a sensor bolt on mine so I spliced the harness with the old plug into the back of the car.  Be sure it's tight and waterproof or the speedo will be wonky.
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Hey-u

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small case vs medium case diffs
« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2010, 11:57:55 AM »
Does anybody know what the weight difference between small and medium is?

tjts1

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« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2010, 01:20:29 PM »
A little over 20lb.
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« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2010, 06:33:49 PM »
Quote from: tjts1;89617
A little over 20lb.


Thats a fair amount. Any idea how much HP will the small case handle?

harvey2

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« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2010, 06:47:46 PM »
Quote from: Hey-u;89629
Thats a fair amount. Any idea how much HP will the small case handle?

I think they are rated for torque, not HP.  I looked it up on the internet (and we all know how reliable that can be) with these results:

small case diff, rated for 240 ft-lbs
med case diff, rated for 420 ft-lbs

A medium case diff just replaced my small case one this morning.  Will be back on the road in a couple of days.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2010, 06:49:48 PM by harvey2 »
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deekay

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« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2010, 08:05:08 PM »
i recently swapped out the old medium-case 4.10 clutch-type LSD for a torsen diff out of a Z3. everything was a straight swap, but i had to use the rear cover from the old M3 diff.

i cannot recommend one of these torsen units highly enough. they are amazing, and somehow just know where the grip is.

if you're gonna be hunting up a medium-case anyway, might as well check and see if you can find one of those.
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« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2010, 09:31:50 PM »
Quote from: deekay;89632
i recently swapped out the old medium-case 4.10 clutch-type LSD for a torsen diff out of a Z3. everything was a straight swap, but i had to use the rear cover from the old M3 diff.

i cannot recommend one of these torsen units highly enough. they are amazing, and somehow just know where the grip is.

if you're gonna be hunting up a medium-case anyway, might as well check and see if you can find one of those.



The one that got bolted into my car is a Torsen as well, also from Z3.  I think the word is starting to get out on these things.  

We had no problem with the speed sensor connector, it was identical  between my small case 4.10 and the new Torsen, so didn't have to swap the rear cover.
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tjts1

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« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2010, 09:35:16 PM »
Which model year Z3s had the torsen diffs and in what ratios?
thanks
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harvey2

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« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2010, 10:05:02 PM »
The most complete info I have found on quick search is this from E30tech:

Good diff. info. in this thread, thanks to the OP for posting his experience. I'll just add that a good source for Torsen diffs. is the non-M Z3s (MZ3s only had clutch packs). Here are the ratios:

Clutch Packs:
Z3 M52 2.8 Manual 3.15
Z3 M52 2.8 Auto 4.10

Torsen units:
Z3 M52tu 2.5 Manual 3.15
Z3 M52tu 2.5 Auto 4.27
Z3 M52tu 2.8 Manual 3.15
Z3 M52tu 2.8 Auto 4.10
Z3 M54 2.5 Manual 3.46
Z3 M54 2.5 Auto 3.64
Z3 M54 3.0 Manual 3.07
Z3 M54 3.0 Auto 3.46

Clutch Packs
Z3 S52 3.2 Manual 3.23
Z3 S54 3.2 Manual 3.15

Info. on the Z3 Torsen on this site: http://www.zvolution.com/documents/00/77/SI_00_77_98_Z3_coupe_2.8_and_M_coupe_Introduction.pdf

full thread here:http://www.e30tech.com/forum/showthread.php?t=83982
« Last Edit: March 17, 2010, 10:10:10 PM by harvey2 »
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tjts1

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« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2010, 11:11:46 PM »
Excellent info, thanks!
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harvey2

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« Reply #13 on: March 18, 2010, 04:04:48 PM »
One thing that had me puzzled about the Torsen diff is in trying to equate the parameter "% locking value" given by BMW to the Torque Bias Ratio parameter used by Torsen.  I found a relationship between these that may apply.

The locking factor is S where S = 100% x (torque difference between the two wheels / total torque of both wheels)

You can define that one wheel is working on a surface with coefficient H while the other is on coefficient L and both wheels are receiving the most torque available from the diff and are at their limits of friction.  

In this case

H = (S+1)/2    and L = (-S+1)/2

the torque bias ratio is H/L.

Now, with these we can plug in numbers and find that for most stock BMW limited slip diffs, which are rated at 25% lockup,

H = .625 and  L = .375   so for BMW diffs, the TBR is 1.67


A 40% lockup diff would have a TBR of 2.33.

source:  http://www.unofficialbmw.com/all/drivetrain/all_differential_lockup.html

I also emailed the manufacturer of the Torsen differential and received this reply to my question about TBR vs lockup in a 2000 Z3 coupe:

Yes, that unit was manufactured at our sister plant outside of Brussels, Belgium.  Your 2000 Z3 would probably have a Torsen T-2 rather than a T-1 in its axle.  We refer  to the differential’s locking effect as its torque bias ratio or TBR.  Torsen T-2 models typically have a TBR around 2.0:1.  Think of the Torsen as a torque multiplier, so what it does is take the available torque that is being lost on the wheel that is spinning up or losing traction and through the differential multiplying it times 2.0 and sending it to the slower spinning tire which usually is the one with the better traction.
 
If you look on the products page of our website and click on the  Torsen T-2 link it will take you to the actual copy of our technical information sheet.  The one graphic where it shows 20% on one side of the differential and 80% on the other is not correct.  The numbers should be more like 35% and 65%.  It was a graphic design error we never caught.

We hope this better explains for you how the Torsen works. Thanks for the question and interest in Torsen!



their website is:http://www.torsen.com/

This responder obviously was not certain of exactly what went into the Z3, but was interesting anyway.
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