A Sad Day in Iraq

[bmwman91]

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/11/14/iraq.main/index.html

Seriously, this is absolutely uncalled for. These people had nothing to do with the whole debaucle over there. Disgusting. My thoughts go out to these people and their families.

[RED IS 91]

All we can do is pray for those people .
They kill their own people just because they are sunni or shiite ......
It's just fucking sad ................
If and it's a BIG IF .. democracy does take hold there, then it will be better for the whole region :)
We're in now so we have to see it through ..
My two cents

[sheepdog]

You can blame Sadaam for this. He did nothing to stop the imbalance between the groups. In fact he encouraged it. The biggest problem I see though is that those people do not understand democracy. They have no respect or understanding of the ideas behind it even.

Sucks for those people, but it will only get worse before it gets better. Those people over there only understand violence.


I am just glad Rumsfeld is out of there, that dipshit never should have gotten to where he was. Everyone in the military who knew of him, were scared when he took command. The man does not even understand his own military code of justice. Combine that with Bush and you have a recipe for disaster.

While we needed to either go in, or pull out of the middle east, a bit better planning would have been smart. I honestly think the planners gave Bush the worst plan they could come up with, hoping it would convince him to not do it, but instead he accepted it.

[sheepdog]

They kill their own people just because they are sunni or shiite ......
It's just fucking sad ................

Like we are much different?
Blacks vs white (KKK anyyone?)
Bloods Vs. Crips.

[shellback]

I'm glad we are there to keep everything stable - just imagine if the situation gets out of hand and it turns into a civil war...:rolleyes:

[RED IS 91]

Like we are much different?
Blacks vs white (KKK anyyone?)
Bloods Vs. Crips.

that's quite a stretch ..........................
it would be like the catholics stringing up protestants and muslims killing jews in our country..
Like I always say "everyone hates us but can't wait to get here ."

There are alot more people there (iraq)that want us than don't want us but the liberal media won't report on that because they hate bush.
We let those people down in the first gulf war and saddam went and killed a shit load of them to make sure they didn't rise up against him again.
We told the Kurds that we would help them and instead let saddam take his helicopters up there and wipe them out.
I think i put in my 4 cents this time.

We need Bagdad Bob back for some light comedy relief.......

[romkasponka]

I'm glad we are there to keep everything stable - just imagine if the situation gets out of hand and it turns into a civil war...:rolleyes:

just imagine Vietnam.

and read http://i-cias.com/e.o/iraq_5.htm

These people growned up in such condition which was created by foreign countries interests. USA started this war (without UN resaolution) and now we all see what is attained, because there was now good plan what to do after military compaign then you breaking all country infostructure. And dont forget civil war in USA.

[bmwman91]

This whole Iraq fiasco I feel is largely due to a complete lack of planning and forethought by the administration. Whatever the case, the place is a wreck. It seems like "staying the course" is basically just going to waste billions more tax dollars...the place is headed to hell in a handbasket, and our presence is not going to stop it IMO.

Playing with FIRE! Discussing politics! Things will probably be a lot more civil in here than in BFc's WWWWar & Politics section!

[GruntE30]

Its sad to say but as sadistic as saddam was, he was the only one that kept that country in check.

[RED IS 91]

The terrorist are all happy that the democrats won :confused:

Makes you wonder ..........................

One thing is for sure we haven't had an attack in the Homeland since 9/11

What's the use of the worlds most potent military if you can't kicked some ASS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bmwman91]

Yeah, my thoughts on the "war" were...

It is not possible to win a politically correct war. You cannot expect to succeed at going in and getting only the "bad guys" and not harming innocents. Hell, it has been projected that 150,000 civilians have died so far. We may as well have gone in with 2x the troops and wiped the floor with everyone, bombed the shit out of cities, and broken the peoples' will to resist anything. I certainly do not advocate that, but playing nicely over there sure has not staved off any insurgency. This thing is another Vietnam...the baddies are totally mixxed in with the innocents and we cannot get away with killing everyone (and rightfully so). We should have just left it the hell alone. All or nothing...half-ass it and you get what we prresently have.

Saddam was an asshole, no question, but there are NUMEROUS other nations with leaders at least that bad. Look around Africa. Look at South America. There are folks in those places at least as barbaric, maybe moreso. They just do not have enough natural resources for anyone to care much.

The whole Iraq War making us safer/Bush stopping terrorism thing/no more big attacks since 911...that is an endless debate. I personally do not think that Iraq made us any safer...probably less so since we pissed the Middle East off even more. Iraq has become a psychotic salt-lick for terrorists (as said by Dennis Miller). As far as Dubya stopping other attacks, well the only major one I heard about was stopped by British Intel.. My opinion though. I think that ANY president who was in power during something like 911 and the following years would have performed the same.

At any rate, we need an exit plan, and fast. I do not think we should just leave right away as it is completely unfair to the people of the nation we invaded. We should set a date, and do everything we can to prep the new government and police/militia for autonomy. When the day comes, it is time to go byebye. The place seems hellbent on civil war no matter what, so sadly there will probably be countless deaths and suffering beyond the already immense civilian death. I am tired of tens of Billions of $$$ being spent on the nonsensical occupation. That $ could be much better used for other things (that it never will be used for). Sigh....politics.

[RED IS 91]

I agree :)

[sheepdog]

Saddam was an asshole, no question, but there are NUMEROUS other nations with leaders at least that bad. Look around Africa. Look at South America. There are folks in those places at least as barbaric, maybe moreso. They just do not have enough natural resources for anyone to care much.


Yes, but you do not have the media pushing for anything against those other nations. Without that, you will have a hard time getting our government to do anything. Even if oil is involved.

Plus, we had 2 choices this time, go in, or leave. We needed to do something, we could not sit in the desert indefinitely like we were. it is bad enough we are still in Korea. And Columbia, Afghanistan, etc...


You want to know the scariest part if this, our military is only setup to fight 2 wars at once. We have commited huge amounts of resources to Korea. Now in Afghanistan, and also Iraq. We are stretched so thin right now we could not even handle a peace keeping mission. We have not had The Guard doing so much in decades, possibly ever. If we have to take on anything else, we will be in severe trouble.

[sheepdog]

that's quite a stretch ..........................
it would be like the catholics stringing up protestants and muslims killing jews in our country..

Yup, different, we just bomb churches, abortion clinics and such. Or how about other hate crimes. Gay marriage anyone? How many trans-gendered and gay people are killed every year? Or how about we protest at a soldiers funeral and say he is going to hell and he deserved it? No one during the last L.A. riots were killed, no one looted, and no one shot at helicopters during Katrina recovery efforts or looted, everyone helped everyone. Speaking of which, I am so glad we got that all taken care of.

Seems to me we tend to search muslims more at airports than any other religion or race (Cat Stevens anyone?) and they were scared to death after 911 for fear of retribution. How about M.L.K., Muhammad Ali, Malcom X. Ask a black man how often he gets pulled over for nothing.


For such a great civil society, we are pretty pathetic.
We may be better, but by how much.

[RED IS 91]

Yup, different, we just bomb churches, abortion clinics and such. Or how about other hate crimes. Gay marriage anyone? How many trans-gendered and gay people are killed every year? Or how about we protest at a soldiers funeral and say he is going to hell and he deserved it? No one during the last L.A. riots were killed, no one looted, and no one shot at helicopters during Katrina recovery efforts or looted, everyone helped everyone. Speaking of which, I am so glad we got that all taken care of.

Seems to me we tend to search muslims more at airports than any other religion or race (Cat Stevens anyone?) and they were scared to death after 911 for fear of retribution. How about M.L.K., Muhammad Ali, Malcom X. Ask a black man how often he gets pulled over for nothing.


For such a great civil society, we are pretty pathetic.
We may be better, but by how much.

You think that doesn't happen in other countries ???????????
If you knew a blonde haired 6 foot 3 inch male was killing people would you stop all the 5 foot female spanish people and interogate them ....................?
Of course they are profiling muslims ! who would you like them to keep an eye on?
Look around the world (which I've traveled) and say to yourself where would I like to live and my answer is always the USA.Where would you rather live ???
You might not like it but it's the best thing going .........

The other great countries
China ? don't think so
Russia ? not a chance
Germany where are beloved cars come from ?? Nice but there human rights history is not to good .
Canada ?? just to cold .......
If I keep yakking I'll probably get banned from this forum for sticking up for america .:)

[sheepdog]

You think that doesn't happen in other countries ???????????
If you knew a blonde haired 6 foot 3 inch male was killing people would you stop all the 5 foot female spanish people and interogate them ....................?
Of course they are profiling muslims ! who would you like them to keep an eye on?
Look around the world (which I've traveled) and say to yourself where would I like to live and my answer is always the USA.Where would you rather live ???
You might not like it but it's the best thing going .........

The other great countries
China ? don't think so
Russia ? not a chance
Germany where are beloved cars come from ?? Nice but there human rights history is not to good .
Canada ?? just to cold .......
If I keep yakking I'll probably get banned from this forum for sticking up for america .:)

I never said America was terrible, just that a lot of what is going on in Iraq happens here as well, just a slightly different level.

As for where to live, the US is high on the list, but not the highest, and yes i have been out of the country before.

[aaron_silva]

just a slightly different level.

Haha.

Aaron

[sheepdog]

I get the distinct impression neither of you live, or have lived in the ghetto.

May as well be living in a 3rd world country.

[RED IS 91]

I get the distinct impression neither of you live, or have lived in the ghetto.

May as well be living in a 3rd world country.

No ,I haven't lived in the ghetto .
I don't know if that makes me lucky or not ???
What's your point ???
Is Iraq like the Ghetto ???
If it wasn't for America overseas then everyone would be speaking German right now ..
Remember that little conflict (WW2).

Let's agree to disagree........
OK???

[romkasponka]

If it wasn't for America overseas then everyone would be speaking German right now ..
Remember that little conflict (WW2).


Do you think that I should speek english because of that? :)

Then why USA let to occupy Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia, Poland and so on after WWII by Russia?

[D. Clay]

Recently my brother and I flew across country on a super saver flight that stopped at every other airport. There was a drop dead georgeous blonde on the same flight. My brother and I got behind her and she was pulled out of line everytime for a search and we walked through. You could tell the security guys really regretted they couldn't do a cavity search on her. My point - I sure hope all of the terrorists out there don't figure that one out. If they get behind a young girl with her nipples pointing out of her t-shirt and Daisy Dukes with a camel toe we're all goners!

[sheepdog]

No ,I haven't lived in the ghetto .
I don't know if that makes me lucky or not ???
What's your point ???
Is Iraq like the Ghetto ???
If it wasn't for America overseas then everyone would be speaking German right now ..
Remember that little conflict (WW2).

Let's agree to disagree........
OK???

Lucky, yes.
In some cities it is almost as much of a warzone as Iraq.

Not sure what you are reffering to about the America thing (except maybe change the direction of the thread).

[RED IS 91]

Do you think that I should speek english because of that? :)

Then why USA let to occupy Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia, Poland and so on after WWII by Russia?

Unfortunately Russia was our ally (an enemy of my enemy is my friend) so they occupied much of eastern europe .If Germany didn't have to fight on both sides of their country they would have won but they were spred too thin and were stomped by the allies.
But we're talking about Iraq now and the american involvement . If you haven't gathered by now I'm glad we went in there and kicked saddam out and I think if they can plant the seed of Democracy then the region will be a better place and the people can rule themselves instead of having some dictator tell them what to think and do .
Wow , I never thought this thread would get to this but at least we have the freedom to say what we feel and that's what's great about america and freedom . My father was a P.O.W. in Germany for 6 months and when we always asked him about it all he would ever say was "it was no picnic".
Alot of men and women have given their lives for freedom in this country and also other countries around the world .
We take our freedoms for granted when people around the globe only dream about what we have .
I'm sorry if I've offended anybody but I've always said what I feel and expect the same from the people I know.
Live Free or Die !!!!!!!!!!!!!

[RED IS 91]

Recently my brother and I flew across country on a super saver flight that stopped at every other airport. There was a drop dead georgeous blonde on the same flight. My brother and I got behind her and she was pulled out of line everytime for a search and we walked through. You could tell the security guys really regretted they couldn't do a cavity search on her. My point - I sure hope all of the terrorists out there don't figure that one out. If they get behind a young girl with her nipples pointing out of her t-shirt and Daisy Dukes with a camel toe we're all goners!


NIPS AND TOE
WE DEMAND PICS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Febi Guibo]

If they get behind a young girl with her nipples pointing out of her t-shirt and Daisy Dukes with a camel toe we're all goners!

...well... if I had to pick a way to go!

--

there is an old israeli joke:

"Everytime I fly, I carry a bomb with me..."
"My god, why??"
"Because, what are the odds that someone else on the plane has a bomb too?"