M42club.com - Home of the BMW E30/E36 318i/iS
PAPER OR PLASTIC => Vendors / GB => Topic started by: thumper3ld on March 18, 2006, 09:19:33 AM
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How about a strut bar group buy?
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Yeah, sounds fine.... Not all the 1-piece bars will fit the M42
which ones do you like? I've seen sparco bars for a group buy in the past...
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the sparco ones would match my car nicely:)
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actually... this is one item we could probably have made for us. I can't imagine it would be like, that difficult. Anyone have any ideas on the possibility??
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Wouldnt mind that either
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Wouldnt mind that either
my brother has all the programs already written for the plates for the strut bar. we were going to make one for my car, its a dual bar design. when he gets back from mexico ill ask him what it would cost to get a couple made (he's an engineer, and hes just in the works of buying a couple machines, a cnc, and a lathe). so hopfuly this will pan out. lets get a list going of who wants in, then we will go from there
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my brother has all the programs already written for the plates for the strut bar. we were going to make one for my car, its a dual bar design. when he gets back from mexico ill ask him what it would cost to get a couple made (he's an engineer, and hes just in the works of buying a couple machines, a cnc, and a lathe). so hopfuly this will pan out. lets get a list going of who wants in, then we will go from there
Im want in.
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+1 ...we just need an ETA
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+1 ...we just need an ETA
and ballpark price ;)
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and ballpark price ;)
about 170$ for 10 bars is what he said.
the more people the cheaper it gets.
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Sounds good! How about shipping to europe?
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Sounds good! How about shipping to europe?
ill ship but you'd have to pay the price. i'm not sure what it would be but i doubt its cheap.
its gona be a squar bar design, instead of the tube that the sparco has, it will be alluminum as well.
i'm gona tlak to him to see if i can get the price any lower, but as it stands 170 is the price. + shipping
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If that falls through, hopefully spring break I'm gonna start building strut bars for mine atleast. Let me know if that falls through and I could build more.
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well it wont fall through as long as we can get some people together. lets start a list alright? add yourself if you want one, and your willing price beside it. if we can get a decent sized list (atleast 5) i think we can go ahead and get them made.
GB list
Kowalski
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GB list
Kowalski
Thumper3ld
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so anyone else besides us?
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so anyone else besides us?
do you have something designed already? Like a 3d rendering or anything?
Is it going to be 1 piece, or hinged?
As far as I know, the Hartge twin tube bar, and the Racing Dynamics bar fits our cars without an issue - I don't know how big of a difference it would be, but the RD one is hinged, whereas the Hartge or the replica of them are 1 piece.
If you are thinking about making something like the Hartge one, I'm in.
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count me in! the lower the price... the better...
I may be able to help with the shipping for folks in the usa... eg, you would ship to my location, i would ship to members...
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count me in! the lower the price... the better...
I may be able to help with the shipping for folks in the usa... eg, you would ship to my location, i would ship to members...
Tell you what Guibes, you dont even need to ship it to me, you can just drop it off or i'll pick it up.
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add me to the list too, i just hope i have the monetary means the time this comes around
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Sparco one hits my Valve cover :(
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Actually... that brings up an interesting point... this guy has like, the most amazing 2002 (http://www.m2bmw.com/cooper.htm) I've ever seen... he has a strut tower brace that looks like this:
(http://www.m2bmw.com/images/newcoop3.jpg)
If you look closely, it has a rubber bushing/mount thing that actually, well, touches the valve cover. He describes it like this:
One-off aluminum front strut tower brace tying into engine w/valve cover bracket/rubber bushing. The solution makes the engine a stressed member and greatly reduces engine vibration/mount fatigue/exhaust movement
Is that something we would/could/should (?) do with out custom strut bar?
Or is it a baaaaaaad idea?
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count me in! the lower the price... the better...
I may be able to help with the shipping for folks in the usa... eg, you would ship to my location, i would ship to members...
i'd be down with that, makes shipping a whole lot easier and less messy. pluss it will cheaper that way. Hiro, yeah my brothers got the program made for cutting out the plates that go on the shock tower, he will just have to cut them out, then make a jig for the bar. The hinge i thought was a bonus to a strut bar? my brother was talkin about putting a hinge in, ill ask him which would be stronger.
any other questions? or questions i missed?
jajou318 does that mean your in?
GB list
Kowalski
Thumper3ld
royalflush313
stevohill
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add me to the list too, i just hope i have the monetary means the time this comes around
+1
Sparco one hits my Valve cover :(
Dood, where have you been? How's the car?
Kowalski: Is the contruction of these bars straight forward? Has your bro made any in the past?
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its fairly straight forward, its just making the jig for welding them once the pieces are made that will take a little time.
my brother is an engineer (just for anyone thats wondering about his capabilities) he hasn't made any strut bars in the past no, he designed one for my car, but we never actualy made any cause of the cost to produce just one.
as for the time span, hes just just making arrangements iwth the bank so he can buy a CNC machine and some other machines. so unfortunatly for some it wont be complete for a little while, but thats fortunate for others. (he said a couple months) so perhaps by mid to late summer? sorry to some of you that were expecting these quickly...
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I dont want to jack the thread so much, but I do have the option to get these made in steel, would be DOM, and would be very similar to the sparco style bar...
But would need a decent list of interest to get the ball rolling...
I have made one for our m42...
Hinged is generally a bad idea as it allows the energy to transfer through the hinge as opposed to being solid...
The rubber bumper on the valve cover seems like a really bad idea, as its more of a fix for another problem (weak engine mounts)
And aluminum would have to be square as mentioned HOWEVER aluminum doesnt have the ability to flex several times like steel does, so as the loads transfer into the bar over and over, you will eventually weaken the bar, whereas steel has spring to it. Bend some aluminum tube, and bend some steel tube, you'll see the difference...
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the steel bar would be much heavier, and the alluminum bar would last more then the life of the car... anyways, anyone feel free to opt for this, i didn't realize that it would be this long to wait for the bars when i offered, i will offer again once he has the machines in hand.
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There is a guy on ebay that makes all kinds of braces.
Dinno has one and it is really well built.
If we could get him to make
this (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BMW-E36-M3-RACE-FRONT-TOWER-STRUT-BAR-Aluminum-Alloy_W0QQitemZ8051078718QQcategoryZ33591QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) style for us I would buy.
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in comparison, 2 aluminum 1.25" tubes will weigh 1 pound less than 1 single 1.25" bar... the plates will be able to be thinner, I used 1/8 on mine, where as aluminum would need to be slightly larger... Our bar in the sparco style design weighs probably 5lbs...
I will say that an aluminum unit, will weigh less, but would be far more extensive... as in the gusseting shown, and and the 2 bar design, or the square design with mitered and welded bends, Bent square tubing looks tacky.
I can do these in aluminum too, but there is no reason to as its just overkill for the application. Plus prices would get jacked... Steel units raw with no paint could be as little as $110 and with enough people up front I could probably work on that price
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Snowmann would you be able to take some pictures so we get an idea of what it looks like? Also, what's DOM?
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Ill get some pics at work tomorrow or friday
DOM is a specialized seamless tube used for rollcages and tubular structures, suspension components etc...
its an acronym for drawn over mandrel, its a process which insures regularity in wall thickness and strengthens the tube.
ERW is your run of the mill tubing/pipe that is seam welded.
The one we made goes all the way around the strut towers... so like a full circle, you'll have to see the pics... If I got plates cut I would just have them utilize the two bolts like the sparco units.
I hand cut the plates for ours as it was just one piece.
The way I look at it, the aluminum units are more for a look factor, you'll be hard pressed to find an aluminum style stress bar on race car that has a bend in it... I have seen them in applications that allow for a straight tube w/o bends
The hinge thing has also been gone over countless times, Its a bad deal, the only perk is having the ability to quickly access motor parts, but the way I look at it, if you're pulling the intake manifold or something to that nature, you are not really in for a quick repair anyway, so what difference does it make to undo 4 nuts at that point...
My other reasoning for not using all 3 bolts on the shock tower, is that when one has caster/camber plates, you loose your settings by undoing all 3 bolts... This has become a pita for our race car, but once again, we rarely remove the unit, but its just nice to not have to go through setting up the car again after doing engine work.
Ill try and get some pics for you guys
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Heres some pics
As I said the circular mounting plates would be basically chopped in half and would only utilize the two inboard bolts...
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Heres some pics
As I said the circular mounting plates would be basically chopped in half and would only utilize the two inboard bolts...
do you have any pictures of that bar installed on your 318is?
The sparco bar won't fit our cars - well I guess we could use spacers and use it, but even then, the clearance is like paper thin.
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no i dont currently, the motor is out and we are working our butts off to get it back together for race season... so i could put it on the chassis but its missing the motor part to show you clearances...
It runs ABOVE the upper manifold, it slightly rubs the hood padding, (left a light scuff in our paint)
thought about going behind as if you've ever seen a mustang style strut bar it actually ties the towers together with the firewall...
These aren't built to a t to the sparcos if thats the way your taking it... they're just a similar design is what I mean
Mine on my street 325 is basically identical however i used less height in the hoop of the tube, therefore I would think that these would also fit non-m42 cars...
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i'd be in for a strut brace. i've been wanting to get one anyways, so i might as well contribute to get the cost lower.
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E30 TOWER BARS THAT FIT ALL PLENUMS
FRONT BAR WEIGHS 3LB REAR WEIGHS 2LB
CONTACT ME AT johnmason55@adelphia.net
http://m42club.com/fotomat/mason/IM007464.JPG
http://m42club.com/fotomat/mason/IM007465.JPG
http://m42club.com/fotomat/mason/IM007466.JPG
http://m42club.com/fotomat/mason/IM007467.JPG
http://m42club.com/fotomat/mason/IM007467_1.JPG
http://m42club.com/fotomat/mason/IM007468.JPG
http://m42club.com/fotomat/mason/IM007469.JPG
http://m42club.com/fotomat/mason/IM007469_1.JPG
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John if we were to say get 10 people to buy the fronts what kind of price would we be looking at?
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John if we were to say get 10 people to buy the fronts what kind of price would we be looking at?
THE 1 PIECE 3LB. ALUMINUM FRONT TOWER BAR"S I MAKE FIT OVER THE 6TOWER STUDS, THE FRONT PAIR OF STUDS SHOULD MEASURE APP. 36 3/16 INCH CENTER TO CENTER ACROSS MEASURE FIRST, THERE IS SOME SLIGHT OF VARIANCE AS I USE .375 HOLES THAT FIT ONTO .312 DIA. STUDS=8MM
MY PRICE LIST STATES EACH $190 =ALUM. & $165= STEEL $20 FOR UPS SHIPPING IN THE US, 1O AT A TIME $160 WOULD WORK FOR ME , YOU PEOPLE AS YOU ARE DEALING WITH THE MANUFACTURE OF THE BARS, I CAN TELL YOU WHICH ALLOY TUBE IS USED,WHICH WELD FILLER WIRE IS USED, AND PURITY OF SHIELDING GASES IF REQUIRED, THERE ARE 2 DIFFERENT WELD WIRES 4043 THAT IS COMMON SOFT FLEXIBLE OR 5356 HI- STRENGTH =HARD BUT DOES NOT FLEX WE USE THAT ON RACING APPLICATIONS BUT KEEP AN EYE FOR CRACKS THAT OCCASIONLY OCCUR THAT WE REPAIR TIME TO TIME FROM A RESULT OF CYCLIC EXTREME USAGE ,YOU GUYS USE 4043
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Keep In Mind What You Do To The Front To Add Structural Integrity To Chassis Should Also Be Added To Back Of Chassis, What Occurs With Only Front Addition Is That A Bend Moment Is Created Somewhere App. In The Middle , And You Get The Wiggles Half Way Thru The Corner As The Front Is Tracking And The Back Is Not Maintaning The Proper Ideal Suspension Settings Whilst Encountering G Forces Result=roll Couple Under Steer/push
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well... if we can get this group buy going... I'm IN!
(let's go peeps!)
(as jay and jonas know.... all of my stut tower bolts are... uh, brand new!)
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well... if we can get this group buy going... I'm IN!
(let's go peeps!)
(as jay and jonas know.... all of my stut tower bolts are... uh, brand new!)
I'm in also, if i can catch back up with my finances by the time this goes down. Vacationing can drain your bank acct.
ooh and yes, febi is aka, she-ra.
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John, can you be more specific about the group buy pricing? Are the aluminun strut bars $160/shipped? Also, you recommend the rear bar to go along with the strut bar, what goup buy price could you do for the aluminum strut/rear bar combo?
Thanks again for joining in on this strut bar subject.
Fabby
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John, can you be more specific about the group buy pricing? Are the aluminun strut bars $160/shipped? Also, you recommend the rear bar to go along with the strut bar, what goup buy price could you do for the aluminum strut/rear bar combo?
Thanks again for joining in on this strut bar subject.
Fabby
TO MY UNDERSTANDING - I WILL SUPPLY A LOT QUANTITY OF 10 TOWER BARS FOR THE QUOTED PRICE, THE SHIPPING HAS BEEN PREVIOUSLY STATED AT $20 PER BAR / $29 = CAR SETS FOR UPS IN THE US, DESIGN AND FITTING HAS BEEN DESCRIBED/SHOWN PREVIOUSLY
E30 CAR SETS ALUMINUM ALLOY $320+$29
E30 CAR SETS STEEL$279 + $29 , GO TO EBAY SELLER= JJMTOOLS AND READ 200 FEEDBACKS FROM BAR BUYERS, GOOD STUFF THEY ARE HAPPY, THEY LIKE THEM,THEY WORK
FOR TECHNICAL INQUIRIES CONTACT= johnmason55@adelphia.net
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i'd be down for the purchase of front and rear bars in aluminum...
anyone???
how much of a difference is there in strength from the aluminum to the steel bars, just curious.
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Can't make out the name but it looks like Mason.
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^^yes
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i'm very intrested...
let's try to get a model of something, ya?
GB list
Kowalski
Thumper3ld
royalflush313
stevohill
gunsmoke
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Bringing this back from the dead.
Any chance we could try to get this going again?
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im down for something like that, whats the status on any of those bars?