M42club.com - Home of the BMW E30/E36 318i/iS
DISCUSSION => Engine + Driveline => Topic started by: Rockiii on May 18, 2014, 05:22:00 PM
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Hey guys, i know i will start a heavy discussion now, but which kind of oil you're using?
I'm living im germany, most of the bmw engines are running with 10W40 oder 5W30 here, but which are you running in which location?
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I run pretty thick oils to preserve the motor, but I've lost about 5% in fuel mileage due that choice. My favorite here in the Northern US is "synthetic" Mobil1 15w50, largely based on cost and availability. I run it year-round. My used oil tests (from Blackstone Labs) have determined that thinner oils (like 0w20 and 5w30) allow very high wear in my very high-mileage motor. Mine is approaching a half-million KM (290K miles) and she's seen better days.
Your European oils aren't the same as ours - they're labeled differently due to America's sloppy standards. Mobil1 (Group III) is labeled as 'synthetic' here but must be sold as 'conventional' motor oil in Europe. All major manufacturers offer high-quality synthetic oils. I'd suggest Castrol, Motul or Liqui-Moly synthetics; I've had good luck with all of them, and they're very high quality.
For more lubricant information than you could possibly need:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php
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Not wanting this to become an infamous 'oil thread' but I run Castrol1 5w30 Extended Performance Synthetic(15k mile one) in both my E30's and the results speak for themselves.
This is the head of the 318i with 181k:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-deG-_6Mz5ag/U3oUoOdxTYI/AAAAAAAACZw/dCYCXojdw2s/w812-h609-no/photo.JPG)
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Not wanting this to become an infamous 'oil thread' but I run Castrol1 5w30 Extended Performance Synthetic(15k mile one) in both my E30's and the results speak for themselves.
This is the head of the 318i with 181k:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-deG-_6Mz5ag/U3oUoOdxTYI/AAAAAAAACZw/dCYCXojdw2s/w812-h609-no/photo.JPG)
This looks very good to me, what about the oil consumption with this oil?
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I use Shell Rotella T 15W40
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On the 318i, it uses/loses about .5qt of oil per change. I change the oil every 6months which is ~3500 miles since he lives, works and goes to school in downtown Cincinnati.
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I use the oil I drain out of my "good" cars which is Mobil1 sumpin-30W. I don't particularly care about this engine and if it blows I'll finally have the motivation I need to build the motor I took out of it. ::)
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I'm stabilizing on Mobil 1 15W-50, having tried their 10W-40 high mileage, and 0W-40 European formulas.
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I use the oil I drain out of my "good" cars which is Mobil1 sumpin-30W. I don't particularly care about this engine and if it blows I'll finally have the motivation I need to build the motor I took out of it. ::)
I do the same thing, but the BMW is one of my 'good' cars, LOL. I've found that the cars "break-in" the synthetic lubes a good bit, and that's perfect for my motorcycles. Wet clutches tend to slip with low-friction synthetics ("Energy Conserving" types), but used synthetics work very well. I've been doing this for years, getting 'free' oil for my bikes. Some of the lubes I use are fairly expensive, but they'll likely go through three vehicles before recycling!
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This may be an old folder but it does give some insight into different types of oil
http://www.hardemanmotorsport.nl/vergelijkend_onderzoek.pdf
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Thanks for posting that link jay it was very interesting. Looks like im in good hands with Royal Purple ;D. I know this sounds cheesy but i became a royal purple customer after trying there in store test. The test has two different gears that you can crank by hand, One gear is in royal purple and the other is in some random low budget oil. When you turn the low budget oil there is allot of resistance and you have to put a little force to turn it. Go to the gear with royal purple and the gear almost turns itself! A night and day difference between the two. Not knowing if it was marking hype or not i went ahead and did a full oil change with RP and havent looked back since. Its good to see some actual numbers proving what they say is true unlike some of the other high dollar oils mentioned in the link. I would Recomend RP to any one looking for a good oil.
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I think Royal purple is a bit expensive plus I have to drive very far to get it. So al my cars run on Valvoline Durablend.
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RP is good stuff, I run it in my '84 745i. Red Line is another good company, as is Amsoil. While I have my reservations about Amsoil's "Mary Kay" pyramid marketing, but they do seem to make good products. IMHO they're all overpriced, but they have excellent quality. Those gear tests are just marketing hype, check out BITOG for really in-depth details about lubes.
AFAIC, the best "bang for the buck" are the synth blends, or the cheap 'synthetic' Group III lubes like Mobil1. You can safely extend oil change intervals over 10K miles, and get most of the benefits of pricey PAO lubes.
BTW - heard that NAPA offers pretty cheap used oil analysis (http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx/Motor-Oil-Analysis-Kit/_/R-FIL4077_0429171564) at their stores. They're likely reselling a Wix service (Wix 24077 Oil Analysis Kit), those might be even cheaper. Regardless, $14+shipping to know what's going on in your motor is hard to beat.
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I use Mobil1 5w40 because I feel it works well even with flat-tappet cams, both on this engine and the Nissan V6 that was in my 510 (w/ 280deg .480" re-ground cams. It shouldn't, I know. It has also cleaned the insides of my 230k mile M42 that was nowhere near as clean when I bought it. For me its free so that helps bias me towards it. but if it didn't work I wouldn't use it at all. + Mercedes and AMG approves it so...
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has anyone tried the German Castrol 0W30? i am tempted to try this as it is said to be very good. i have tried mobil1 0w40 and now on castrol 5w40. while the mobil1 is quite good, castrol is noticebly better.
since last may 2014 i had the engine rebuilt with new con rods, bearings, pistons and valves and been on mobil1 0w40 and 39,000km later i want to go back to castrol.
some say our engine m42 is too old to use 0w30 thin oil. any truths in this?
teo
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I use Shell Rotella T Triple 15w40. It's made for over the road diesel tractor trailer trucks. I use my E30 318i for work. I drive at least 100+ miles a day in stop and go traffic in Arizona. I change my oil every 3 months because my odometer doesn't work at the moment. I can find the oil at Wal-Mart, Sam's Club, and pretty much every auto parts store here. I can find it for about little under 14.00 USD per U.S. Gallon.
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I use Shell Rotella T Triple 15w40. It's made for over the road diesel tractor trailer trucks. I use my E30 318i for work. I drive at least 100+ miles a day in stop and go traffic in Arizona. I change my oil every 3 months because my odometer doesn't work at the moment. I can find the oil at Wal-Mart, Sam's Club, and pretty much every auto parts store here. I can find it for about little under 14.00 USD per U.S. Gallon.
I think 15W is not a good idea because it is too thick when cold causing more wear during cold startup. try using a 0W.
i have experimented with 5W, 0W40, 15W50 on my previous M40 24 year old engine with 300K KM mileage and the 0W40 is incredibly good. very clean internal and there's no rebuild of engine. since switching to a 1994 M42 engine in august 2013 and now with 40,000 km, i started with Mobil1 0W40 (European formula) and lately on Castrol 5W40. Castrol is a lot quieter and i feel it is better than Mobil1. then engine revvs a lot easier to 6500
I'm tempted to try Castrol 0W30 because everyone says it is very good. Because i had the engine internals changed 40K km ago - new pistons, con rods, bearings, valves. maybe it is safer now to use thinner oils.
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I think 15W is not a good idea because it is too thick when cold causing more wear during cold startup. try using a 0W.
I think it depends on how and when you run your car. I personally I don't DD my E30, I only really drive it during the summer months. So 15w-40 oil works for me. At 15 degree Celsius the Kinematic viscosity of 15w-40 is 459.60 mm˛/s, at 0-1 degree Celsius 5w-30 & 0w-30 are around the same viscosity. Now If I were to run my car during the winter months, I'd definitely switch to a 0w or 5w.
Here are some charts and graphs I made a couple years ago relating to oil viscosity. Not the greatest charts around but they do the trick. If anyone's interested I can send you the excel file.
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity.png)
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity-chart.png)
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity-bar.png)
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity-bar-chart.png)
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Great information.
However 0W40 it is missing from your graph and it would be interesting to see what happens at even lower temperatures like minus 30c or so.
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I think 15W is not a good idea because it is too thick when cold causing more wear during cold startup. try using a 0W.
I think it depends on how and when you run your car. I personally I don't DD my E30, I only really drive it during the summer months. So 15w-40 oil works for me. At 15 degree Celsius the Kinematic viscosity of 15w-40 is 459.60 mm˛/s, at 0-1 degree Celsius 5w-30 & 0w-30 are around the same viscosity. Now If I were to run my car during the winter months, I'd definitely switch to a 0w or 5w.
Here are some charts and graphs I made a couple years ago relating to oil viscosity. Not the greatest charts around but they do the trick. If anyone's interested I can send you the excel file.
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity.png)
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity-chart.png)
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity-bar.png)
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity-bar-chart.png)
thanks but can't see your grapghs!
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I live in Mesa, Arizona. It hardly freezes here....
I think 15W is not a good idea because it is too thick when cold causing more wear during cold startup. try using a 0W.
I think it depends on how and when you run your car. I personally I don't DD my E30, I only really drive it during the summer months. So 15w-40 oil works for me. At 15 degree Celsius the Kinematic viscosity of 15w-40 is 459.60 mm˛/s, at 0-1 degree Celsius 5w-30 & 0w-30 are around the same viscosity. Now If I were to run my car during the winter months, I'd definitely switch to a 0w or 5w.
Here are some charts and graphs I made a couple years ago relating to oil viscosity. Not the greatest charts around but they do the trick. If anyone's interested I can send you the excel file.
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity.png)
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity-chart.png)
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity-bar.png)
(http://gablabs.ca/m42/Gabs-oil-viscosity-bar-chart.png)
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Necro bump, but I had to post some actual data. I can share the Blackstone UOAs if anyone is interested.
On my high-mileage M42, a 20 weight oil (Pennzoil Platinum 0w20) led to high wear metals being reported in my UOAs. Fuel mileage did improve noticeably, over 3%. Switching back to a nice 40 weight synth oil (Mobil1 10w40) took care of the problems but lost me some fuel mileage.
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Necro bump, but I had to post some actual data. I can share the Blackstone UOAs if anyone is interested.
On my high-mileage M42, a 20 weight oil (Pennzoil Platinum 0w20) led to high wear metals being reported in my UOAs. Fuel mileage did improve noticeably, over 3%. Switching back to a nice 40 weight synth oil (Mobil1 10w40) took care of the problems but lost me some fuel mileage.
Castro 0w30 is very good! smooth and quieter than mobil1 0w40. i hit the sweet spot much earlier than with mobil1. and so i think castrol is better
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Keep in mind that our motors are purposefully built a bit on the sloppy side compared to more recent motors. Car manufacturers are using a lot of methods to reduce friction, including low-friction piston rings and aluminum bearing shells.
Thinner oils are more efficient but don't provide the same level of protection in higher temperature ranges. If you regularly use thinner oils, I'd strongly recommend periodic used oil analysis to determine how well your lubes are performing. They're cheap and well worth the money. If you don't think so...just add up the costs of a full set of main & rod bearing shells...don't forget to budget for a full set of TTY bolts.